' Wrote:I'm a bit confuzzled here. (Oh, and good to see you back in the saddle, Hoss, regardless of past lovers' spats..)
If you're referring to SCRA as that "faction", what of... Visas granted to Zoners? What of.. an SCRA "office" on the TAZ's Skyhook?
If you meant "another" anti-Zoner faction, then never mind.
23's.
I didn't mean any faction, hombre.
'twas a jest, regarding a reputation that some like to saddle me with, what with me apparently being a 'racist' against a fictitious political group.
Meanwhiles, I'mma go put on my eyepatch and rob me some neutrallers, since we all know neutrallers don't got no allies to come help 'em.
Dangerous out there on the frontier, it is.
Also!
Oh, and as it stands, no, an anti-Zoner faction is silly. Now, I could see any number of existing factions taking a disliking to our anarchist friends, following the vanilla storyline in which the Zoners are trying very hard to cling to peace on the frontier, but an anti-Zoner faction is very silly.
I usually throw my two cents in on these threads so as usual I will.
Quote:It is not for Zoners to define how they are seen by others. But it is also not for others to define how Zoners see themselves.
Word. Zoners being neutral to everyone doesn't mean everyone is neutral to us. Get that in your heads.
Quote:Well, true is that zoners need some enemy, its weird when so powerfull faction are neutral with everyone
You provide me with proof we are so powerful.
I am the faction leader of OSI and also the faction leader of the ZDF, the only military style Zoner faction. Guess what? The ZDF is weak, spread thin, and unable to enforce neutrality at all times.
Our power doesn't lie in our military. It lies in our ability to play others. To use words to stop them from killing us. To use words to get from them what we want. To give them what they need so they allow us to survive.
Freeport 5, 9, and Corfu would all be lost in a war with the Corsairs. Freeport 10 lost to the Outcasts if we pissed them off. Others to various factions. Hence the reason we try not to piss off other larger factions and when we do we are quick to attempt to fix our mistake.
That doesn't mean we would lie down without a fight. If the Corsairs did indeed start a bloody conflict with us, you can be damn sure we'd seek alliances with their enemies. Just as we paid the Corsairs to aid us in securing Omega-49. If we do not have the military strength to fight our fight, we seek help from people that do.
I am not going to say this group couldn't exist. I would however find it rather odd that one day this group didn't exist then all of a sudden the next I have a full wing of bombers shooting at me claiming I am to powerful. Odd indeed.
This also leads me to another point, Sprolf. These vary groups are the reason we have a need for capital ships.
I also think this is worth quoting again:
Quote:The chief problem with this faction proposal is that it rests on the idea that Zoners are one faction.
Zoners are one "NPC faction," a term that is made to suit gameplay dynamics. Storywise, the term "Zoner" is equivalent of a borderworld drifter, vagabond, etc. It's a generic callsign for people who have left the Houses and other prominant factions.
The Zoners on Gran Canaria are completely different from those that live on Freeport 9 or Freeport 1. The Zoner Alliance is a pact between these drifter colonies, but even then the alliances are lose and most of the ZA's job involves resolving loopholes in the gameplay (such as, who permits non-Zoners to buy a Conference?).
You want to know some differences?
-OSI refuses to feed any faction war material. TAZ and the ZTC have no qualms doing so.
-TAZ is interested in aiding the Council in defeating the GRN. OSI rarely sends ships into Gallia because we happen to live on their doorstep and are fearful of our Freeport being destroyed by them. ZTC is neutral to the GRN, they don't send any ships into Gallia space.
We do not always agree, quite the opposite. There is usually a lot of disagreements between us. Another example is the use of faction right #5. I really don't want to use it because Faction A might be hated by Zoners in the Omicrons but he helps my faction in the Taus. Using #5 would mean all Zoners hate him, which isn't really true.
Quote:personally, i'ld burn 90% of the zoners passing trough the Corsair space. They are rude, silent and obnoxious. Neutrality has to be earned.
Only Ivan knows this but I'll go ahead and let it out here. I have a Corsair and I target only Zoners in the Omegas. I do so because I work hard to earn the trust of the Corsairs so they won't blow me up on my Zoner and it erks me to no end that other Corsairs don't rough up the Zoners in the Omegas that don't aid them.
I will disagree with Ivan in regards to us being a threat to the houses (Outcast and Corsairs included). Yes we have capital ships but not even 1/3 of what a house navy has. All of our stations could easily fall in a quick tactical strike made by the local factions. The reason this doesn't happen is because in doing so that faction would earn the title of the first faction that Zoners in general made war upon. Not truly a scary thought when you consider just Zoners. It becomes scary when you add in the fact that it is our way of life to hire others to aid us. Ala Corsairs fighting for us in Omega-49 to prevent the BAF from taking the system from us. Such is our way of life.
The only factions we are a threat to are ones smaller than us.
Quote:Goals:
-To limit the power of the Zoners. (not complete annihilation or genocide god no)
-Enlighten the people of Sirius to the threat of the Zoners.
-Infiltrate and spy on Zoner activities.
Your first goal is already met. As long as we have no sworn enemy our warships remain weaker than all other warships. Our transport is weak so that we have to rely on words to get out of jams (or past history with our attacker.) You won't remove Jinkusu, they aren't warships. They are mobile freeports and colony ships. Yes, some are used as warships. Even as a Zoner faction leader I cannot prevent that.
Most people are already enlighten as to our threat. Ala why the House governments banned our largest transports from docking in their space. A hint as to why: To protect the profits of their own local companies.
Infiltrate and spy on us? Good luck. You'd gain nothing from infiltrating OSI, little from TAZ other than what they intend to do. Infiltrating the ZTC? Good luck. I am a Zoner faction leader and I have NO idea what they do.
Quote:'Spying on Zoners'- they could RP like sneaking on Freeports and getting 'evidence' of Zoner invasion plans which are actually fakes and cool stuff like that.
No not really. That is power gaming. Even if we planed on an invasion (lulz!) we wouldn't keep that info on our Freeports. That would be stored within Sparta or Cornith. Both stations you wouldn't have a chance in hell in accessing, much less making off with intel that critical. (I need to read huh:sleep:) You could make it up, but it would be easy to discredit not to mention if we were a real threat, we wouldn't keep intel like that on a Freeport.
Quote:Diplomacy:
Hostile to Zoners. Neutral/self defence to House police/militarys. Neutral/self defence towards Outcasts. Unfriendly towards the Corsairs, Order.
Operation areas:
Anywhere were there is a large amount of Zoners (so not Liberty and the Houses except for spreading anti zoner propoganda) and Zoner bases.
Your best bet would be to set up shop in a house. Who are you going to preach to in the Bordworlds? The Corsairs? They will laugh at you if you tell them Zoners are a threat to them. Same with the Outcasts. Also, if you are hostile to us, you aren't operating on our bases.
After all of that. I'd support this if it limited itself to a house. You wouldn't have the funding to operate in the border worlds and the powers there would laugh at you before shooting you for insulting them by claiming Zoners are a threat to them. (The GRN would just shoot you before you could utter a word.)
Also, please try to keep in mind that always forcing us into a position where we have to come to the forums and forum RP 'diplomacy' isn't always fun for us. It might not bother you because you only do it once to us, but add your version to the list and you see the erksome nature of it.
Want a clue as to the goings on now? Read the TAZ and ZTC message dumps. The MR is roughing Zoners in Dublin up. Do you see OSI doing much about it? No, because I've only had one ship damaged by them, not unusual for a shipping company. My character might end up getting involved for himself because he lives on Canaria but OSI as a whole probably won't unless we get shot to hell and back.
OSI rates -9000. We have no capitals and our security wings is small.
TAZ and ZTC are strong but on their own couldn't stand up to any other faction out there. (I say that, but I am ignorant to their inner workings, keep that in mind.)
ZoE as far as I know they have their Jinkusu as a mobile HQ and they don't enforce the NFZs, they pay the ZDF to do it. (Quit sending your credits!)
' Wrote:Oh, and as it stands, no, an anti-Zoner faction is silly. Now, I could see any number of existing factions taking a disliking to our anarchist friends, following the vanilla storyline in which the Zoners are trying very hard to cling to peace on the frontier, but an anti-Zoner faction is very silly.
Looks like you have been doing some posting while I've been asleep. Well, thank you for your feed back all, 70+ posts is a great lot of information to get.
@Cross- The goals of the faction would never be completed. Like how the goals of many factions will never be completed. They are just a basis of RP.
Anyway......
Judging from the general moot of the people around, id say that most people are anti an anti Zoner faction. Here is my final statement:
There is nothing to stop an Anti Zoner faction being formed. It can be done, fully in roleplay and no one could stop someone from forming this faction. But do I really want to force changes on the Zoner RP? Do I want to attempt to disrupt the main ideology on which one of the largest factions in Sirius is based on all just for what I might consider fun? Certainly not. Thats not what I would want to happen, there are certain lines which one shouldn't cross: Lines which define a faction.
So sure I could do this, probably have quite a few members too. But I wouldnt' want to have that guilt you know- on my shoulders...that im fighting something that doesn't want me to fight it. Thank you to all posters, your feedback was invaluable. I was mostly looking for information from the Zoners themselves, faction leaders, faction representitives, Zoner players. If the Zoners dont want it. I wont grief them by starting this up. Two factions fighting together has to be an oorp agreement. The Hessians and RM in oorp agree to fight each other if you know what im saying. The Rogues fight the LN and so forth.
Sure im a little disappointed, but its not like I didn't think this might happen. Maybe ill mull the idea of a House capital pacification group over in my mind a bit. But in conclusion. I wont start up the Anti Zoner Syndicate- peace out Zoners I <3 u ;)
' Wrote:Infiltrating the ZTC? Good luck. I am a Zoner faction leader and I have NO idea what they do.
I was a roleplaying leader in ZTC for a time (one of three) and I wasn't even given access to certain classified info.
I tripple dog dare anybody to infiltrate that faction's top secrets without metagaming. I'd pay money to see that.
Marshal: The key to your goal is to pick a fight with a player faction instead of just all Zoners. But you will have to get in line despite what you said to Malaclypse. The Zoners are constantly fighting some player faction, right now it's the Mollys and GRN. Before that it was Black Sails. Before that QCP and Smokes. Before that OPG. Etc..
No it's not a daily dogfighting fest, but it's no less dangerous than roleplaying a corporate trader. In fact, it's more dangerous because in addition to the occassional pirate you also have to deal with the "I hate Zoners!" faction of the week.
The Corsairs constantly are telling us to bend over...
The Mollies would like us to bend over even further...
The Houses already distrust us enough to ban our Guards and Whales from their bases, and...
The Gallians just want us dead.
I'm afraid you'd have to stand in line, sir.
And Saerieve is hunting Zoners just for its fun.... oh wait, Saerieve is Gallic ... nevermind!
On Topic: Well, Its a nice Idea but dont turn it into a OORPly Anti-Zoner Faction. I mean, Keep things In-Character, you know, some guys really Hate anyone who RP as a Zoner, which is a really lame thing.
Anyways, Good Luck with that, and ... even I might do some 'Political Discussions' with you guys on Saerieve to become friends or sth, if I see its worth it! D:
Marshal, don't be swayed simply because there are those that don't want it. I personally don't want another Blunt era QCP as it wasn't inRP nor was it fun for anyone but the members of the QCP.
If you want to make a faction that has specific purposes and sticks to those, like the Arvg era QCP does. I will go as far as helping you with the background and other such things.
I am also going to quote Blue again as from your last post you still seem to think that Zoners are one faction.
Quote:The chief problem with this faction proposal is that it rests on the idea that Zoners are one faction.
Zoners are one "NPC faction," a term that is made to suit gameplay dynamics. Storywise, the term "Zoner" is equivalent of a borderworld drifter, vagabond, etc. It's a generic callsign for people who have left the Houses and other prominant factions.
The Zoners on Gran Canaria are completely different from those that live on Freeport 9 or Freeport 1. The Zoner Alliance is a pact between these drifter colonies, but even then the alliances are lose and most of the ZA's job involves resolving loopholes in the gameplay (such as, who permits non-Zoners to buy a Conference?).
Quote:Two factions fighting together has to be an oorp agreement. The Hessians and RM in oorp agree to fight each other if you know what im saying. The Rogues fight the LN and so forth.
Problem is it wouldn't be two factions fighting each other. It would be you (one) faction fighting a collective of other factions (TAZ, ZTC, OSI, ZoE, ZDF). The ZDF is the only linking element there, and it stems from the ZA. An alliance between the other four factions.
Well, as much of a "NO U" fest that this has turned out to be, I would like to remind you all of something. Just because people say something in RP, it doesn't mean that they, as a person believe it, or that it's true.
We don't always have to tell the truth, in RP.
Oh, and @Mal: I can still see one of the "controversial parts" of her "bumpy bits".
Edit@Mal'sEdit: Oh well, it's in the right place. Well, sort of.
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