New PvP Rules Proposal

[Igiss]

Well it seems ok, until we get people who dont have any cencept of honour on the server then it'll be like this again and we'll get this discussion again.

How do you collect evidence someone used F1? If 5 people post it on forums about one char, it's obvious. But if it's one exceptional case? you cannot prove it, and the accused person cannot defend himself. It's impossible to make video chronicles of everything happening with you in-game.

[Korrd]

1.10 After a player respawns after being killed, he or she has a right to ask to leave him or her alone and escape with no cargo onboard, and attackers must let the player escape. Useless repetative killing is prohibited.

I like this. It puts an end to harrassment.

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[Igiss]

Ok, I guess we've agreed on the rules, and version published in the first post will be put in action tomorrow. Christmas time, time to change rules ;)

No nanobots and shield batteries restrictions will be implemented this time. In 4.79 I will reduce number of nanobots for capital ships, which should solve most problems. Shields of capital ships are already vulnerable enough. And I don't believe that people spend millions on capships only to be destroyed by fighters while having full load of nanobots/batteries they cannot use. F1 total restriction for capital ships seems to be enough for me.

[Firebird]

Sweet...my opinion counted for something :lol: :yahoo: :lol:

Ok...i'm done :D

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[xit]

Yes, I know the rules have already been applied, so this is rather pointless, but I still want to express my opinion about the rules. :)

I like all the rules except for one small part of 1.9, namely the part which says:

Using F1 in PvP combat is allowed for traders only when they run out of all nanobots and shield batteries.

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As I'm a person that's not a member of any factions (except the U.G.T.C. for a day or so, until my character disappeared, just like the faction apparently. Only faction I would have ever joined, as a matter of fact), and who's only here for the simple pleasure of exploring, trading, meeting people, helping newcomers, and generally just hanging out, I deeply dislike that part.

If I'm flying around with 20+ millions in cargo I'm not going to hang around waiting to get shot to pieces and loose all the credits. If I'm threatened by people (i.e. I'm close to going Argh! I'm going to die. I'm going to DIE!!!) I'm bloody well going to F1 out of there.
On the other hand if I'm flying around with no cargo, just exploring, finding new traderoutes, then by all means attack me, and blow me apart! I won't F1, I won't use nanobots or shield batteries (they are reserved for NPC pirates, of if people attack me just before docking with a planet/station/tradelane/whatever), heck I won't even attack back (no weapons onboard, why should I? I'm a friendly trader, that's that). Will probably make a fighter character at one point though, and that char won't do all of this. :)

OK, I might understand the rule if it's a trader character that is connected to a faction in some way, because then it would actually have an impact on the community as such, how large or small it might be.

An exception to all this would be characters who actually play in character. For example pirates that actually show up as hostile on my hud (only real pirates there are in my opinion), now those people I don't mind. They actually behave correctly, and roleplay as they should. So far the only character I've met that does so is actually daedalus, but that's a different subject. Then again I haven't had much time lately to get online...

Oh, and please don't start whining up about I could just as well play singleplayer instead of this. I enjoy this game because of the multiplayer aspect.

If people don't like all of this, then complain to Igiss and let him ban me, or shoot me apart ingame. I'm not going to change. Simple as that. :)

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[Igiss]

Rules have not been applied yet, and I suppose that what Xit said is worth considering.

[daedalus]

1.9 Using F1 in PvP combat is allowed for traders only when they run out of all nanobots and shield batteries. Using F1 for fighters is allowed only if they run out of all nanobots and shield batteries, are outnumbered and/or outclassed and have unmounted equipment worth more than 1 million onboard.

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I have to take major issue with this. Firstly, if the above rule is implemented, there will be no point in playing here and I'll be leaving to another server (but I'll hang around on the boards, of course). It would be a brilliant mod spoiled by silly server rules. What is the point in allowing F1? Crossfire has the right approach, check it out. And that's not the only bad rule.

Secondly, and Igiss, I know this is the season of goodwill, but I have to say that you're making the server rules look like a legal document. If I were looking to join a server and found I had to read through something like that I would go elsewhere. The server rules should be short and simple, and something that can be written in the console. Not everyone wants to visit the forums all the time to check the rules. Take Nesa as an example - please correct me if I'm wrong, but Nesa is a major player that does not use this forum.

My opinion, for what it's worth (and I've played on many, many servers), is that a server only needs 4 rules:

1. No pvp in New York
2. No attacking players under a certain level (in this case 30)
3. No attacking non-hostile players
4. Good manners and game etiquette required at all times

To explain my thinking:

1. I include the no pvp in New York rule as most players are familiar with it and it is on most servers. But I don't think it's all that necessary as new players and storage characters will be protected by Rule 2 and probably Rule 3 as well. I know some people like to have a place where they can chill, but hey, Sirius is quite large, and this rule doesn't stop npcs attacking you.

2. This rule is obviously to protect new characters. I think having a rule whereby characters under a certain level can attack characters also under a certain level is too complicated and unnecessary - keep it simple.

3. This rule is to encourage roleplay, and might seem strange at first, but it works - think about it. I'm talking hostile in terms of the reputation system. Players that don't wish to be attacked can roleplay a neutral character, but at the same time they'll have less chance of being able to attack someone else. A player that wishes to engage in pvp will first have to at least roleplay a good guy/bad guy, or even as a faction, in order to encounter friendly or hostile players. Using this rule, xit, for example, could trade to his hearts content and be ignored by other players.

4. This is a general catch-all rule that I think everyone will understand. It can include no swearing, abuse, using F1, blockading a base, "dockraping", repetitive kills, etc etc. Anything that is not in the good spirit of Freelancer. If players can't tell what's good and bad manners, they deserve to be kicked.

I welcome comments. Some might want a rule about defending against illegal attacks. Well, I do not recommend this, as it can lead to 'who fired first' arguments. It's easier to resolve if you don't retaliate.

Lastly I'd like to thank xit for recognising that I'm about the only person on this server that roleplays. Roleplay isn't just about this forum or the chat console, it's what your character *does*.

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Role-played characters:
daedalus - Liberty Navy
bandersnatch - Ruthless criminal possessed by a (huge) alien
Shredder - Small-time Kusari pirate, looking to join the Blood Dragons

"Bounty Hunters. We don't need that scum." - Admiral Piett

[Khuskan]

1.  No pvp in New York
2.  No attacking players under a certain level (in this case 30)
3.  No attacking non-hostile players
4.  Good manners and game etiquette required at all times

Couldnt agree more with those. Not only would a simple rule set like that be simple and noob-friendly, it would also stop all the current issues with 'Cheating' accusations, as well as the current complexity of clan conflicts.

Rules like saying what can use nanobots, what cant, and when they can be used are stupidly hard to enforce, and lead to players accusing people of cheating, without evidence. Its impossible to prove sombody was using them.

[Igiss]

what can use nanobots, what cant

There were no rules about using nanobots and shield batteries.

Daedalus is right in many ways. The simple rules he suggested are easy to understand and are very similar to rules that are in action on server now. But even here there's an issue with level: what about escorting, if player below level 30 group with higher level players? Obvious first amendment to rules that Daedalus is proposing is to allow attacking player of lvl 29 and below if they are attacking themselves and if they are grouped with a more powerful player.

Later on, hostile players. We have no 'real' reputation system here, that's why all talks about 'real roleplaying' arose. If there were tags and real reputation differences between factions, it would be much simplier. But now - I don't see how can this be done.

As for fourth rule, it seems doubtful, however sounds fine.

This is a general catch-all rule that I think everyone will understand.

Everyone will understand it in his/her own way. Which will mean that the situation that we have now could repeat every day, with people accusing each other of cheating and honorless behaviour. Then it will be necessary to comment out the 4th rule to make the understanding common for all, and then the rules plus comments will become not shorter, but probably longer.

F1 issue - I agree that F1 should never be used, still many people will use it. Read what Xit posted before.

[xit]

Nice simple rules, daedalus. I like them. :)
And don't mention it. I actually don't mind getting attacked by you, simply because you actually roleplay.

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Beware the Lazy Invasion of the Lonely Mudcrab of Doom!
Lady Arwen's Realm