/home

[Mr.Fabulous]

This topic is an add-on to the this Zigeris's Inspirational Link. Thanks for giving me an idea to help contribute, dude!

actually, I'm up for this idea...

just something I'd like to point out:

I don't think there's any need to add more stations into the systems...

Rather than introducing new stations in empty space, why not utilize current ones (or planets), sort of like buying your own pad within the EXISTING stations/planets?

It would work somewhat like the /pimpship command, but this time it would be in the commodities bar:

The command would be /home. What this tool will be used is mainly for storage and quick transfers between account characters. Initially, it would be reserved only for the character

There would be five /home sub-commands:

1. /buyhome:
   Of course, you'd have to buy your pad before owning it, right? This is where you will be showed a list of available houses to choose from. Depending on the station/planet you are in, there are at max 5 different selections to choose from; the higher the cost, the more available space you'll be given to store your goods.
   
   When you've already purchased your pad, and wish to upgrade, you'll unfortunately have to /sellhome, and then buy the one you like.
   
   An also helpful feature: you can have multiple homes all across Sirius! Need a place to quick-store your Nomad Brains when you're in Delta? Go buy a FP11 lot, and make it a hunting lounge! Need a place to keep all your RP-artifacts away from prying militaries? Buy a lot in Ames Research Station, where the scientists will happily take care of them for you!
   
   Another important note: You'll need to be friendly (green-rep) with the faction owning the place.
   
2. /paytaxes <creditamount>:
   One of the cons of the /home command will be that you'll need to pay "taxes"... oh yes... taxes...
   
   How it'll work? It's simply a set amount of credits (amount depending upon the level) you'll need to pay to the console in order to keep it active. The frequency, I'm not at liberty to discuss; could be monthly.
   
   You won't be able to down-pay your taxes; it's either fully-paid, or it's gonna be wiped.
   
3. /sellhome:
   If you sell the pad, you'll at least get 50% of what you paid back. This is a bit helpful, considering that the only way to upgrade your home would be to sell it, and THEN /buyhome the new level you want.
   
   The pad could also be sold if the owner doesn't wish to maintain it further, like for say he's going on a very long vacation, or that he decides to rage-quit...
   
4. /transferdeed <char>:
   ... unless... you could ALSO transfer the rights to your home if you've got a buddy who can keep your pad nice and cosy. Just type in /transferdeed <char>, and that home gets shared along with that char's other existing (if any) homes. The cooldown for this will be 1 month/transfer, so choose your transfers wisely!
   
5. /myhome: NOW we enter the main use of your home; when you type in /myhome, you'll be further introduced with 4 more sub-commands to choose from:
   
   1. /sethomecode <code>:
      This is a command that will give the home a distinct ID for the later commands to use, a sort of name for your own pad.
      
   2. /goods <commodity/equipment> <good> <goodamount> <take/store>:
      The bread-and-butter of the /home command, it's what handles your current stocks.
      
      To transfer goods from your ship (character) to you home, complete the parameters.
      
      For example, if you want to store in 50 units of consumer goods into your bin:
      /goods commodity consumer-goods 50 store
      
      When you've done this, and want to make sure the CG have been successfully placed in the bin, simply type in /goods commodity, and you'll be given the entire list of your tradeable goods. The same goes for your equipment like torpedoes and missiles, so for would-be CODENAME-sellers, /home is an alternative to storing your precious weapons in your destroyable ships.
      
      An important note: Factions could also benefit from this, too! Rather than have armory ships roaming around, you could store these equipments in a specific base... The cons for this, I guess, is that armories won't be raided anymore... but other suggestions could help mitigate this.
      
   3. /resident <char> <let/leave>: This only works for those accounts with multiple characters; what it does is let your other character be able to utilise the home.
      
      For example: Timmy wants to be with his bro, John. John, being the owner of the place, types in the command:
      /resident Timmy let
      
      This makes Timmy able to utilise the home for his own use. This can only work IF Timmy's also friendly with the home-owner's landlord faction.
      
      BUT BEWARE! As a consequence, Timmy will also be subject to the tax, so a downside to this is that, if you have many characters sharing many homes, you'll need to constantly pay for their respective taxes, or else be kicked out of the rights to use it. Fortunately, the costs for the rent will be significantly-less than the real owner, so the only problem of it is it's repetitiveness...
      
   4. /transfergoods </sethomecode-code> <commodity/equipment> <good> <goodamount>:
      Have two homes, but transfering goods between homes too hassle for you? Too lazy for such grunt-work?
      
      Don't worry! The NPC-haulers will happily do it for you for a price of 10 credits/unit!
      
      For example: say you need to transfer 50 units of consumer-goods from your small bachelor pad in FP-11 to your real home in FP-2. Simply input the parameters like so:
      /transfergoods FP-2 commodity consumer-goods 50 (this is when you set your /sethomecode on your home in Freeport 2 as FP-2)
      
      Then 500 credits from your character will be used to transfer the CG to Freeport 2 in the blink of an eye! By the time you get to your other home on FP-2, the consumer goods will be there, already unpacked, safe and sound.
      
      This could be abused (especially for smugglers), so there'll be rules to follow or the code won't work:
      
      1. The goods aren't illegal within their respective transfer location: You can't transfer Artifacts from Planet Crete to any house station that bans them! Same goes for Cardamine from Cadiz to Trenton! The list goes on, but you get the idea... unless you're an idiot...
         
      2. It can only be done if their landlords are friendly with the other, or with the same faction: Not even neutral-rep will cut it. This means that, for example, IMG-homeowners can only do this command with the Colonial Remnant since they're the only ones who are friendly with the IMG, while the rest are neutral-repped. Same goes for groups like the Zoners, Junkers, Hogosha, etc. IND-homeowners will be able to transfer their goods with DSE-, Universal-, or Liberty-Military-faction-homes. And you most certainly CANNOT NPC-blockade-run the Liberty-Rheinland war...
         
      3. A very high hauling price to make it too impractical for money-making purposes:
         Let's say, for example, Niobium Ore... That costs around 8000+ credits (I could be wrong,:D) at the highest selling point, which is at Planet New Berlin.
         
         What I meant for VERY HIGH hauling price is that you take a certain good, get its current highest selling price possible in all of sirius, multiply that by a factor of x0.80 (could be more, could be less), and then that's what you'll have to pay to haul it ANYWHERE ELSE.
         
         So going back: to haul Niobium Ore would cost around 6.4K credits/unit to haul it from Java to Cardiff, or from Stokes to Kyushu, or from point A to point B.
         
         Of course, that'll only lessen the impact, when you could do it numerous times in a few minutes...
         
      4. A long cooldown period to make it's "profit/sec" too meager or non-existant: (edited)
         ... But what about if for every /transfergoods, you'd have to wait for 1-2 hours before you could do it again? Since it's kinda fast and easy for ships to go to and fro places, when you make the cooldown period in hours it makes for a very slow rate, rather than if you'd just do the run yourself! This cooldown will also apply to every house, which also helps in mitigating its frequency. Another important note: only the homeowner will be able to use the /transfergoods.
         
         For example: Suppose you choose to transfer Food Rations from Crete to Leon Base. When you /transfergoods the food to Leon Base, the Crete-house can't do it again for the next hour... but should you change your mind, you could send it back from Leon Base-house to Crete-house ONLY WHEN THE HOMEOWNER'S THERE (you can't do the command with a /resident, so for the command to work the buyer of the house has to be there)... and when you choose to send it back to Crete, you then can't use the Leon Base-home to transfer goods again until the cooldown period ends. Also, the two house-locations' cooldown periods will be independent of each other.
         
         So basically, the cooldown period will be too long when compared to just hauling it yourself, and that it applies to every house.
         

What do you think? Complicated, yes... but it's a great feature to implement, IMO.

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[Druen78]

Like it. But it would be WAY TOO HARD to keep under control to avoid abuses. Admins already have hellish amounts of work to do, would you want them to check all the player pads one by one as well?

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[Denelo]

One concern I'd have about this (even assuming it could be implemented) would be trading abuse. You mentioned smugglers; even with only being about to transfer between friendly bases, how hard would it really be to, say, have a home on both Kreuzberg (Junker base in New Berlin) and Rochester (Junker base in New York), have the Rochester base set to /resident for a secondary character, and use /transfergoods back and forth? At that point, you're doing one of the most profitable routes in the game simply by switching characters back and forth.

Or you could do Iridium from Freeport 11 to Gran Canaria. For a full Zoner Whale, that's theoretically 6.4 million credits per trip. However it's normally a 15-minute trip, so that's only 6.8k credits per second (24 million credits an hour), about half of a really "good" trade route. However, if you could instead use this command to run the route in, say, fifteen seconds, that'd be 432.3k credits per second, or one and a half billion credits an hour.

Please note that all numbers are based on old prices and are probably very wrong at this point, but you get the idea regardless; the specifics don't really matter much.

So yes, if this can be implemented, the /transfergoods would definitely have to be taken out.

[mwerte]

So yes, if this can be implemented, the /transfergoods would definitely have to be taken out.

Or limit how much you could 'store' in one home to ~100 units, and even that would cost a pretty penny in the buying cost/tax.

I like this command, I think it's a great money-sink (which disco needs more of) but I think it would be a ****ton of work and there are other more important things, unless you find a bored coder.

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[Elven]

Agreed.

Perhaps ability to transfer anything but not trade goods?

[beander2]

Interesting idea. Commodity storage quantity would definitely have to be strictly limited, or it completely nullifies the entire trading aspect of the game.

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Sir Alisdair Buchanan, KBE ~ Gateway)Trafalgar

[Mr.Fabulous]

One concern I'd have about this (even assuming it could be implemented) would be trading abuse. You mentioned smugglers; even with only being about to transfer between friendly bases, how hard would it really be to, say, have a home on both Kreuzberg (Junker base in New Berlin) and Rochester (Junker base in New York), have the Rochester base set to /resident for a secondary character, and use /transfergoods back and forth? At that point, you're doing one of the most profitable routes in the game simply by switching characters back and forth.

Or you could do Iridium from Freeport 11 to Gran Canaria. For a full Zoner Whale, that's theoretically 6.4 million credits per trip. However it's normally a 15-minute trip, so that's only 6.8k credits per second (24 million credits an hour), about half of a really "good" trade route. However, if you could instead use this command to run the route in, say, fifteen seconds, that'd be 432.3k credits per second, or one and a half billion credits an hour.

Please note that all numbers are based on old prices and are probably very wrong at this point, but you get the idea regardless; the specifics don't really matter much.

So yes, if this can be implemented, the /transfergoods would definitely have to be taken out.

you could also make the /transfergoods have:

1. A very high hauling price to make it too impractical for money-making purposes:
   Let's say, for example, Niobium Ore... That costs around 8000+ credits (I could be wrong,:D) at the highest selling point, which is at Planet New Berlin.
   
   What I meant for VERY HIGH hauling price is that you take a certain good, get its current highest selling price possible in all of sirius, multiply that by a factor of x0.80 (could be more, could be less), and then that's what you'll have to pay to haul it ANYWHERE ELSE.
   
   So going back: to haul Niobium Ore would cost around 6.4K credits/unit to haul it from Java to Cardiff, or from Stokes to Kyushu, or from point A to point B.
   
   Of course, that'll only lessen the impact, when you could do it numerous times in a few minutes...
   
2. A long cooldown period to make it's "profit/sec" too meager or non-existant: (edited)
   ... But what about if for every /transfergoods, you'd have to wait for 1-2 hours before you could do it again? Since it's kinda fast and easy for ships to go to and fro places, when you make the cooldown period in hours it makes for a very slow rate, rather than if you'd just do the run yourself! This cooldown will also apply to every house, which also helps in mitigating its frequency. Another important note: only the homeowner will be able to use the /transfergoods.
   
   For example: Suppose you choose to transfer Food Rations from Crete to Leon Base. When you /transfergoods the food to Leon Base, the Crete-house can't do it again for the next hour... but should you change your mind, you could send it back from Leon Base-house to Crete-house ONLY WHEN THE HOMEOWNER'S THERE (you can't do the command with a /resident, so for the command to work the buyer of the house has to be there)... and when you choose to send it back to Crete, you then can't use the Leon Base-home to transfer goods again until the cooldown period ends. Also, the two house-locations' cooldown periods will be independent of each other.
   
   So basically, the cooldown period will be too long when compared to just hauling it yourself, and that it applies to every house.
   

My suggestions on how to answer your concern. What do you think?

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[Denelo]

you could also make the /transfergoods have:

1. A very high hauling price to make it too impractical for money-making purposes:
   Let's say, for example, Niobium Ore... That costs around 8000+ credits (I could be wrong,:D) at the highest selling point, which is at Planet New Berlin.
   
   What I meant for VERY HIGH hauling price is that you take a certain good, get its current highest selling price possible in all of sirius, multiply that by a factor of x0.80 (could be more, could be less), and then that's what you'll have to pay to haul it ANYWHERE ELSE.
   
   So going back: to haul Niobium Ore would cost around 6.4K credits/unit to haul it from Java to Cardiff, or from Stokes to Kyushu, or from point A to point B.
   
   Of course, that'll only lessen the impact, when you could do it numerous times in a few minutes...

That'd work very well for ores and such, as it'd reduce it to local prices, but not at all for cargo with a greater than 500% profit margin. Not that I'm aware of anything like that, but it leave it open for exploitation. Anything with a very high profit margin would immediately become open to abuse; that is, if 20% of the highest selling price is higher than the lowest buying price, then there would still be abuse by repetition, as you mentioned.

A long cooldown period to make it's "profit/sec" too meager or non-existant: (edited)
... But what about if for every /transfergoods, you'd have to wait for 1-2 hours before you could do it again? Since it's kinda fast and easy for ships to go to and fro places, when you make the cooldown period in hours it makes for a very slow rate, rather than if you'd just do the run yourself! This cooldown will also apply to every house, which also helps in mitigating its frequency. Another important note: only the homeowner will be able to use the /transfergoods.

For example: Suppose you choose to transfer Food Rations from Crete to Leon Base. When you /transfergoods the food to Leon Base, the Crete-house can't do it again for the next hour... but should you change your mind, you could send it back from Leon Base-house to Crete-house ONLY WHEN THE HOMEOWNER'S THERE (you can't do the command with a /resident, so for the command to work the buyer of the house has to be there)... and when you choose to send it back to Crete, you then can't use the Leon Base-home to transfer goods again until the cooldown period ends. Also, the two house-locations' cooldown periods will be independent of each other.

So basically, the cooldown period will be too long when compared to just hauling it yourself, and that it applies to every house.

My suggestions on how to answer your concern. What do you think?

Less easily abused, but still not impossible. Even with the cooldown time, you could still make more money than other people by transferring the stuff, then following it with your own load of the same stuff. Voila, two loads for the time input of one.

Please also note that my original concern had to do with the following:

Player John owns two characters; Fred and George.
Homeowner George owns two homes, one on Base A, the other on Base B.
George uses /resident to allow Fred to withdraw items from Base B.
John leaves Fred on Base B, and George on Base A.
George buys items on Base A, then transfers them to Base B.
John then switches characters to Fred.
Fred withdraws items from George's home on Base B and sells them.

Here're my solutions. They may have problems as well, and they're certainly not the only ones, but I'd much rather be part of the solution than just point out the problems, personally.

1. Place extremely strict limitations on the quantities to be transferred in a specific period of time. i.e., 10 units per day or something. Probably a bad idea, since it mostly defeats the purpose of this anyhow, and people would still abuse it even despite that.
   
   
2. Cause the command to actually spawn an NPC convoy that moves the stuff to the desired destination. The items don't get there until the convoy does, and if the convoy is destroyed? Woops, there goes your stuff. Probably my favorite idea, but it'd be extremely difficult to implement; even beyond the obvious, every time the convoy jumped, it'd have to despawn and respawn, and FLHook would have to track every convoy individually, possibly causing lag and stability issues.
   
   
3. Add a truly ridiculous price tag, i.e., 100%-120% of the maximum sell price anywhere in Sirius per transfer. Probably the most workable idea, since rather than minimizing abusability, it'd negate it from the get-go; however, this would probably lead to complaints, and would minimize certain roleplaying events.
   
   
4. Remove the /transfergoods command entirely. Probably the simplest and easiest solution for everyone, especially since it removes a major coding aspect and prevents us from having to avert abuse like this altogether. Even if we were to come up with a great solution here, someone, at some point, would still find a way to abuse it. People are like that.
   

So there you go.

[Coin]

Don't have transfer of goods between bases. too easy for abuse.

having a place to store spare codies/AU/etc so that you can log into another ship and pick them up/mount them would be niice, but not commodities.

You also need to exclude ID's from this list - or people would be able to switch id's too easily

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[Atomic.Blue]

The Idea of having a storage Bin on a few stations would be a great idea. Would help a few people get rid of some of there ships they use just for codie holders. I think It would help with RP too.. Like not having to fly 2 or 3 systems to get nova torpedos and having them in a few "Pads" would help me out a lot.

But the commodite tranfer sound like a bad Idea

let me get some millatary supplies from rinland and just tranfer them to the war for bertoina $$.. To easy to abuse + you dont get to RP a char hulling them..

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