How a player faction excludes a characteristic of the NPC faction

[n00bl3t]

Also, Zoner capital ships are the final nail.

No, wait, you are an idiot.

Edit:

The problem with taking it point by point without context is you can never get a full view of whats going on. My point was that this was one of the reasons for the situation, and your response was "One of the Corsair's, thusly your, positions is that the Zoners are annoyingly fractured. Therefor there must be war." Yes, I guess I can see how you got that if you looked at only a single part of a sentence out of an entire post, but if you had read the whole thing you would see how wrong you are. What you are trying to do is sniping. Picking one comment or part of a comment out of a larger thing, and trying to use it without context to discredit the entire argument, when you know if you discussed the same comment in the context of the larger post, you would not be able to make the easy argument you are trying to make.

Noted. (A useful post, just not in the way you intended it. I suppose a context paradox just got achieved.)

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Anything I say is not intended as offensive, and to try and deliberately misinterpret it as such would be an attempt at trolling via misrepresentation.

It's not a conspiracy, it's localised bias. They're not intelligent enough to form a conspiracy.

[Coin]

Here are the basic arguments as I understand them.

Corsairs in-game started to attack Zoners in-game because Zoners "supposedly" rarely brought food to Crete (in-game).

On the other side we have Corsairs in-game demanding that a second docking ring be built around Gran Canaria because Corsairs are standing in long lines due to traffic.

Now.

How many Corsair vessels in-game have actually brought goods to Gran Canaria and back in the past, say, year?

Do you get where I'm going with this?

where do you think all the pirated goods end up? Crete? gran canaria is a great place to drop off the goodies.

blue, you continually make the mistake of thinking that corsairs are reasonable people. we're not.

you're dealing with hungry pirates, and you have food. you forgot to make the deliveries.

the price of having a freeport deep in corsair space was that you'd provide the victuals, and in return we'd ignore the fact that many oc raids are launched from there.

the blockade of theta is a little reminder... hungryyyyyyyyyyy.

its tie to get busy talkin or get busy diein

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A Day in the Life of an NPC | Coin | The Journal of Caius Oakley | Build Your Dream Boat

[n00bl3t]

where do you think all the pirated goods end up? Crete? gran canaria is a great place to drop off the goodies.

blue, you continually make the mistake of thinking that corsairs are reasonable people. we're not.

you're dealing with hungry pirates, and you have food. you forgot to make the deliveries.

the price of having a freeport deep in corsair space was that you'd provide the victuals, and in return we'd ignore the fact that many oc raids are launched from there.

the blockade of theta is a little reminder... hungryyyyyyyyyyy.

its tie to get busy talkin or get busy diein

Fail post is fail.

Zoners provide food for sale, not a delivery service to your doorstep. (Actually it pretty much is, considering the Corsair Q_Q about Theta being on the doorstep of Omicron Gamma. Of course, the hypocrisy of FP9 being on the Corsair doorstep but too far to get food from is hilarious.)

As for your first line, yes, fencing stolen goods also require Zoners.

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Anything I say is not intended as offensive, and to try and deliberately misinterpret it as such would be an attempt at trolling via misrepresentation.

It's not a conspiracy, it's localised bias. They're not intelligent enough to form a conspiracy.

[Agmen of Eladesor]

Fail post is fail.

Zoners provide food for sale, not a delivery service to your doorstep. (Actually it pretty much is, considering the Corsair Q_Q about Theta being on the doorstep of Omicron Gamma. Of course, the hypocrisy of FP9 being on the Corsair doorstep but too far to get food from is hilarious.)

As for your first line, yes, fencing stolen goods also require Zoners.

Interesting that things degenerate here again when you come back, Richard. Just a coincidence that it was dying down, and now it's not?

Coin was simply making a point, and you denigrate his position by simply calling it fail. He's making the point from the perspective of a Corsair - which is really the biggest issue we have here, that the two main parties involved have different role-play perspectives. And when one of those parties decided to not do something that follows their normal role-play, they start complaining on the forums and to the admins about it being unfair and asking admins to step in.

The Freeports are still basically trans-shipment places - they're like the trucking company distribution centers that we have here on earth now. They have the added bonus of providing some fresh food and such, but it's completely unrealistic to assume that a solitary space station can provide enough food for an entire planetary population.

David Weber addressed that quite nicely in his Honor Harrington novels.

Planet Grayson.

Many, MANY space farms - all over the place in orbit - providing food for the population because the people couldn't eat the food that came from the planet. Then suddenly you have them building domes ON the planets surface, which enabled them to create in a controlled environment places to grow food.

Now apply some of the same theories to Crete. Just because these people are pirates does NOT mean that they're inherently stupid or ignorant - you can't have a society capable of building a spaceship that doesn't have some kind of technical base. And with the technical base that the Corsairs have - they could EASILY build bio-domes ON the planet to grow food. Does it cost more? Sure. Is it less efficient than, say, growing food on Stuttgart, where the natural climate allows food to grow openly? Sure. But can it work? Damned straight.

Oh, and fencing stolen goods simply requires someone who is quasi-legal. It doesn't require Zoners - Junkers can do that quite nicely, too. (So can Freelancers, for that matter...)

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Oh god... The end of days... Agmen agreed with me.

[Dusty Lens]

Fail post is fail.

Zoners provide food for sale, not a delivery service to your doorstep. (Actually it pretty much is, considering the Corsair Q_Q about Theta being on the doorstep of Omicron Gamma. Of course, the hypocrisy of FP9 being on the Corsair doorstep but too far to get food from is hilarious.)

As for your first line, yes, fencing stolen goods also require Zoners.

n00bl3t, how do the Zoners store enough food to supply Crete on a tiny little station in Theta?

And with the technical base that the Corsairs have - they could EASILY build bio-domes ON the planet to grow food.

Let's move away from the term "bio dome". In FL a biodome is a self contained technological wonder which is the sole province of Synthfoods. It is designed to operate as a one stop shop for the cultivation, harvest and refinement of said weed to turn into paste, which is then put through enzyme treatment.

It's not a very good system to place planetside, due to both the cost and etc etc etc.

Let's go for another description. Such as, say, greenhouses. If the idea is that Crete's soil is, by and large, nutrient poor or consisting of arid desert then it suggests that what crop production they would already be in a position of maintaining systems with heavy emphasis on recycling and enclosed environments. When the soil is dead and the land dry you can't just afford to throw seeds at rocks and then spray them down with water after all.

But, to go off the Dusty Lens favored model. Let's say there's 500 million Corsairs on Crete.

two acres x 500 000 000 = 4,046,856,422,400 m^2

Gracious. That's a whole lot of green houses. Would be easier to handle if you could just use the land but, wel-p. In this case you would need to employ a lot of artificial constructs.

At a certain point importing chow likely becomes more efficient.

[Agmen of Eladesor]

Let's go for another description. Such as, say, greenhouses. If the idea is that Crete's soil is, by and large, nutrient poor or consisting of arid desert then it suggests that what crop production they would already be in a position of maintaining systems with heavy emphasis on recycling and enclosed environments. When the soil is dead and the land dry you can't just afford to throw seeds at rocks and then spray them down with water after all.

But, to go off the Dusty Lens favored model. Let's say there's 500 million Corsairs on Crete.

two acres x 500 000 000 = 4,046,856,422,400 m^2

Gracious. That's a whole lot of green houses. Would be easier to handle if you could just use the land but, wel-p. In this case you would need to employ a lot of artificial constructs.

At a certain point importing chow likely becomes more efficient.

Except that you're a bit high - in one respect, anyway - you only need 1.2 acres per person to feed at current U.S. dietary requirements, and with regular diet. So you say, wow, we need 600 million acres of greenhouses, then.... (Or at least something to provide nutrients, whether it's compost heaps, wells, and fertilizer factories.)

The Louisiana Superdome covers 13 acres, so does that mean we need 46 million Superdomes? Yes - and no. That also presumes that we're using standard open air farming techniques. Well, if you're growing in a greenhouse, that means that you're able to squeeze more bio-mass in. And one other detail - for a rather varied vegan type of diet - not just sustinence - you only need 0.2 acres per person - so suddenly the land requirements go down tremendously.

I thought the population of Gran Canaria was 500 million - and that Crete was more along the lines of maybe 100 million.

But seriously - with technology that we have today, we could build a greenhouse that covers 20 or 30 acres without any problem. You don't need a huge, unsupported dome - just put up some support pylons similar in height to a wind farm, and you'd be fine. Is it sill a lot of greenhouses? Sure. Does it allow you to become self-supporting? Yep - and sometimes not being dependant upon someone else is more important.

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Oh god... The end of days... Agmen agreed with me.

[Dusty Lens]

For spaceborn biodomes I put the nutritional output at 1 person per .5 acres. For terrestrial greenhouses I went for 2 acres due to physical presence of support infrastructure. Greenhouses take a lot more space than dirt on the ground.

Reducing the acreage still results in rather intimidating numbers. Which would still demand a massive import of water, fertilizer and crop seeds etc.

Also if Crete has a population of 100 million then the Outcasts outnumber them 5 to 1, which seems problematic.

But, given that the Corsairs cannot sustain such a population without external support then they do not have 2,428,113,853,440 m^2 greenhouses.

[globalplayer-svk]

Hm,one question, how much ships need zoners to deliver all the food?

Just asking because the numbers of biodomes and other things are really large

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[Dusty Lens]

Hm,one question, how much ships need zoners to deliver all the food?

Just asking because the numbers of biodomes and other things are really large

The variables I would base that on is how many people you can feed with a "unit" of food, for how long and how many people you're feeding.

[globalplayer-svk]

The variables I would base that on is how many people you can feed with a "unit" of food, for how long and how many people you're feeding.

I mean from the numbers typed above (populations,number of food needed for them and so)

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