Making snubs more appealing

[Durandal]

Not-so-simple question from the devteam to you, community. Before I get to the question let's cover the obvious:

- Turret zoom had a negative impact on snub effectiveness. Removing it is not an option. Variable limits are not currently an option.
- Snubs have a higher learning curve than capital ships for not as much gain as they did in .85.
- Snubs require better reflexes than capital ships.

None of those things are ever really going to change, so what would make flying snubs more appealing for you guys? We devs already have some ideas and while that's great, we're aware that our opinions do not always reflect those of the rest of the server. I can't promise that all your ideas will be feasible, but we would still like to get a general feel for what YOU want.

Fire away.

[Mephistoles]

I think snubs are fine.

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[Chuba]

Yeah, gonna agree with Meph they are fine as they are

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[Swallow]

- Turret zoom had a negative impact on snub effectiveness. Removing it is not an option. Variable limits are not currently an option.

My experience shows that camera offset could be as low as in shiparch.ini (No zoom) for comprehensive TS. I see no reason for variable limits not being an option, because at least you can directly set those in the .ini.
http://discoverygc.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=131616

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FL MOD(EL)MAKING: TOOLS, RESOURCES, TUTORIALS AND MY SHIPS (OLD)

I am on discord: Roal-Yr#5994, I don't log on forum more than a few times a year.

I am not making ships for FL anymore, I am making my own space game instead:
https://github.com/roalyr/GDTLancer
https://roal-yr.itch.io/gdtlancer
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL5HQB...cdH45LZgjj

[Sciamach]

Personally I don't fly snubs because my eyesight is rapidly getting worse and I haven't got the best reflexes. Couple that with the fact that snub fights tend to last SO GODS DAMNED LONG and I just have no desire to spend half an hour endlessly jousting back and forth only to die to a single mine. It's not fun. Flying snubs to the uninitiated just isn't fun when someone with a slightly higher level of skill just can't be killed by anyone lesser.

It's a skillgap. Yeah, I'll freely admit that I need to "get good" but I don't have the time or patience for something so monotonously boring. And even if I did, i'd likely do it in another, more rewarding game.


Now, to end on a more productive note: The issue here is one of balance and the way it's done. The problem we face is one that several other games tend to come across-- but rather than sit here and utterly fail to convey my point, I'll let the experts at Extra Credits handle the job for me. I strongly advise everyone in the balance team give this video a look.


What we have right now in Disco is the scenario mentioned with the "noobtube", and the lack thereof. "You'd instead have a small community of veterans just churning through new players at an alarming rate--Just crushing each noob who dared to show their face in multiplayer. All of those new players would quickly get discouraged and quit."

That scenario sound familiar to anyone? Cos it certainly does for me.

I recall a time when Missiles were there to level the playing field, but someone probably suffering from terminal brain damage decided that such an item needed to go out the window for some utterly contrived reason. This kind of diachotomy is what we need back for snubs to actually be entertaining to the un-initiated again.

Good luck.

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[ sci·am·ach ]
/sīˈamək/

A simple, angry man casually working his way through life on a personal quest to acquire copious amounts of street cred.

[Wesker]

Increase the countermeasure/CD capacity. Any capital ship players nightmare is a snub that can keep it CDd with limits on CD capacity and their performance against caps it makes it kinda tricky. Caps love too spam missiles, I hate missiles, increasing CM capacity on snubs might help.

Make snubs faster.

Make anti snub weaponry for caps only effective against bombers. (Excluding gbs) so that a caps won't effect a snub brawl so dramatically.

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[Yber]

delete caps

From my pov:

snubs aren't appealing because they can't deal with caps and on top of that they're much harder to play. You've already said you're not going to change any of that, leaving as the only option buffing snubs either in damage or in survavility. Since you can't do that without breaking everything else, you're probably looking for snub equipment that deals with caps particularly, which makes it even less appealing because you're giving up options vs other snubs.

Of course you can scale up snub stats a few times to make them able to deal with caps, but then caps aren't appealing.

The fact that unique features were taken away from each individual snub ship (such as the infamous mass nerf on the sabre, removing it's unique strafe, the new "gun rebalance" or the "utility HFs" or the starkiller nerf) has also taken away from snub vs snub situations.

If you're not going to remove zoom, you're not going to nerf razors/solaris/gunboats vs snubs and you're not making snub flight more forgivable in terms of getting 1shot by even other snubs then you literally cannot change anything.

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inb4 Sirius gets renamed to XTF.

[Hidamari]

VHFs and bombers are fine where they are

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[Titan*]

Fighters shouldnt do damage on battleships. So nerf em

[Lythrilux]

Fighters should be kept as far away from Capitals as possible in terms of damaging potential. Hell Fighters should be barely scratching capital shields, and perhaps only being a small but dealable threat against Gunboats. Bombers should be the only snub that is capable of hurting capitals hard. The issue is that Bomber combat is really boring and time consuming, and needs to be made more dynamic and fun.

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