It's not too late to fix Caps

[Wesker]

It's been a long time since I've been to this subform, a year ago I was the most motivated person in the world to make changes to the shipclasses that were my favorites. But the interests of what passed for the "balance team", combined with me lacking a teacher pretty much just drove caps into oblivion. People blame slow storyline development for the lack of activity, but from what I can see from the 999999 skype chats I'm in, its really these cap changes that have made your average "cap raid" just 4 battleships colliding and accusing each other of ganking in some way shape or form. The reason being is simple, ever since 4.87, all the cruiser and gunboat rebalance changes (aside from the removal of cruiser razors), where terrible. People might've sounded motivated then, but everyone I know who was motivated then to fly caps with the 4.88 re balance is now either off the server or hating every capital ship encounter.

What I'm basically getting at is, the current battleship stats, weaponry, and what you call "diversity" is piss. This stupid misconception of "well we need diversity so lets nerf cerbs into the ground." Has made capital ship combat so boring and unappealing. I speak with the voice of all of the capital ship veterans from BAF|A and my gang from 4.87 (which I'm confident in saying are still currently the best and most knowledgeable) that these changes particularly to cerberus turrets and primary turrets, need to be reverted back. As it is with the current stats dreadnoughts are more unappealing than they were in 4.87, never mind how bad cruisers are for anything at this point. This system of mortars doesn't work, this pathetic excuse stating that "diversity will make caps more interesting" doesn't work. Capital ship combat is so reliant on loadout and ship type at this point that people wont log caps solely because of their shipline is incapable of handling another. In other words, skill is nearly irrelevant, with cerberus turrets at high range, turret steering was just as appealing as strafing, and skill in terms of dodging and aiming was far more appealing. This change has pretty much eliminated the skill gap, I've told people time and time again that it has, and people now after bitter losses because of their skill being negated by this stupid rework are finally starting to realize that this was a BAD idea. If you think I'm wrong about numbers dwindling, just look at every cap fight since the cerb nerf in comparison to pre-cerb nerf fights. They were much larger and much more packed, Royal flush had what -100- people attending? Now a days even a core-5 POB siege can't stir up that many people on both sides. Take a look here

4.88.1 fight (largest recorded one I could find pardon the TS) :


4.87 fight:



So behind this bit of text, @Devs this system of cap combat this "balance" doesn't work, its unappealing, people's interest in caps won't come back unless you revert it back.

Obviously just saying "revert it" without specifying -what- wont work altogether. But until I see the Dev's are willing to actually fix this mistake, I won't waste my time posting up specific stats that will just get thrown in the trash.

This is my last time posting one of these, I wasted my time spamming these complaints when cerbs were first nerfed and everyone thought I was crazy for saying it was wrong. Now a lot of those same people are seeing otherwise. If the Devs stay narrow-minded and keep caps on the road to ruin, I'll just stick to snub combat.

-A slightly angry Wesker (sorry for any grammar errors I'm the worst proofreader alive)

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[Arbs]

Yeah this is actually an issue that i've also noticed. Turret steering is a lot less effective now and strafing makes things stall a little because of how it works, you know same speed, prims only and so on which makes it kinda boring.

But in any case I guess it's something that needs to be looked at, and perhaps battleships need some attention as a class.

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"If your heart is filled with faith, then you can't fear."

Fleet Admiral Alan Jones

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Liberty Navy [LN]
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[Gagadug.]

+1 for this.
Caps in their current state are not viable in many fights any more and even if useful victory is apart from rare cases decided by numbers.
There is no point in bringing a cruiser against a battleship any more too, since many of them lost hull/powercore/regens over the last years while Battleships didnt.
I personally dont like the removal of cruiser razors either, it took the anti gunboat weapon from them and now the only way to deal with GBs in cruisers properly is going full solaris.
On a sidenote if someone doesnt see the problem, there is a reason all the capwhores stoped playing regularly or fly snubs now.

[Backo]

I don't fly caps to say what's wrong but the decreasing number of capital ships is a clear sign that something definitely is. Wesker might have a point there.

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Republic of the Sword and Sun

[Shelco]

Approving this message.

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[thisDerius]

I had some ideas regarding capital ships, but I did not make it in detail yet.

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[Unlucky_Soul]

I have already stated my opinion to Wesker and Gaga over skype but Weskers point still stands. Caps need some love

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[Sombs]

Can someone give a simple list of what exactly was different regarding battleships in 4.85?

If I'm honest, I'm pretty okay with the current battleship-PvP. The only thing that annoys the hell out of me is the fact that any a-hat can CD you with any CD. Mighty battleship engines shouldn't be CD'd that simply. There isn't much a battleship can do about snubs, especially light battleships that don't have the power core to effectively flak snubs off, as anything else is too easy to dodge.

Also horrible: Battlecruisers/Destroyers being able to kill battleships very easily without a problem. Both the thrusters and the CDs make the big difference. Either the battleships get a thruster (a slow one) or the BCs/Ds shouldn't have CDs anymore.

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[Unlucky_Soul]

Can someone give a simple list of what exactly was different regarding battleships in 4.85?

If I'm honest, I'm pretty okay with the current battleship-PvP. The only thing that annoys the hell out of me is the fact that any a-hat can CD you with any CD. Mighty battleship engines shouldn't be CD'd that simply. There isn't much a battleship can do about snubs, especially light battleships that don't have the power core to effectively flak snubs off, as anything else is too easy to dodge.

Also horrible: Battlecruisers/Destroyers being able to kill battleships very easily without a problem. Both the thrusters and the CDs make the big difference. Either the battleships get a thruster (a slow one) or the BCs/Ds shouldn't have CDs anymore.

From the top of my head
No turret steering
No Turret splitting
Gun stats

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[diamond1]

Although I can't really say much because of my constant high ping, I can say that for owning a ship with over 510 hours of memories on it, I am getting sick of it. I've had to adapt with the uncomfort of feeling how powerless the cerbs are when they disappear at such a short range, but fights are absolutely tedious with primaries being the real source of fights nowadays, I say change it back so you got my vote too.