Class 9 gun analysis

[Yngen]

I've spent some time in Datastorm comparing the faction weapons in Discovery tonight. There are posts in the balance sticky that Igiss started about balancing guns and I thought it would be beneficial to look at the hard numbers on these things.

Explaination of calculations:
Sheild damage per second: Sheild damage per shot multiplied by shots per second.
Hull damage per second: Hull damage per shot multiplied by shots per second.
Power usage per second: Power used per shot multiplied by shots per second.
Hit rating: average of weapon range and projectile velocity(to describe how likely you are to score a hit.)

Obvious balance questions are bold for overpowered and underlined for underpowered
Shld dmg /sec....................Hull dam. /sec:........................Pwr usg /sec........................Hit Rating
1)Tizona El Cid-845............1)Firekiss-978........................13)Snfrnzy3-533......................1)Buckshot-750
2)Firekiss-489.................2)Samael-640.........................12)Skyblast B-525...................2)Samael-725
3)Samael-320..................3)Kraken 2-572.........................11)Vengeance V-510................3)Kraken-700
4)Vengeance V-286............4)Reaper V-526.........................10)Kraken 2-504.....................3)A splitter-700
5)Reaper V-263..................5)Fury 4-500.............................9)Buckshot-489.....................4)Fury4-675
6)Fury 4-250......................6)Salamanca-489.......................8)Adv. Splitter-480................4)SkyblastB-675
7)Salamanca-245...............7)Adv. Splitter-484.....................7)Samael-482....................4)VengeanceV-675
8)Adv. Splitter-242.............8)Disinfector 3-470.....................6)Reaper V-440.....................5)Snfrnzy3-600
9)Disinfector 3-235.............9)Buckshot-458..........................5)Firekiss-407..................6)TizonaelCid-600
10)Buckshot-229................10)Skyblast B-234......................4)Fury 4-400........................7)Salamanca-600
11)Skyblast B-217..............11)Sunfrenzy 3-206....................3)Salamanca-391..................8)ReaperV-575
12)Sunfrenzy 3-103...........12)Vengeance V-186...................2)Tizona El Cid-384................9)Disinfector3(575)
13)Kraken 2-93.................13)Tizona El Cid-44.....................1)Disinfector 3-368................10)Firekiss-550

Based on the 4 categories above I have ranked these 13 class nine guns from best to worst. The rating number is the average rank in each of the categories:

1)Samael-3.5 (Rogues)
2)Firekiss-4.25 (Reinland)
3)Adv. Splitter-4.5 (Bretonia)
4)Fury4-4.75 (Zoners)
5)Tizona El Cid-5.5 (Corsairs)
6)ReaperV-5.75 (Order)
6)Kraken2-5.75 (Outcasts)
6)Salamanca-5.75 (Salamanca)
7)Disinfector3-6.75 (Kusari)
7)Skyblast B-6.75(GMG)
8)Buckshot-7.25(BHG)
9)VengeanceV-7.75(Liberty)
10)Sunfrenzy3-10.25(Kusari)

(There are other class 9 guns I didn't include in this, basically because I couldn't remmember their names, if I have time I will go back and include the ones I missed.)

If the chart above is too much information, the rating rank after it boils the balance issues down to the basics.

There are other issues to consider before nerfing the Samael or the Firekiss and augmenting the Sunfrenzy or Vengeance. Each of these weapons was designed originally to go on a specific ship, a ship with its own balance characteristics. A companion analysis of faction ships might be beneficial to see if deficiencies in faction equipment are the same for gun and ship.

I can say with some certainty that the Kusari and Liberty VHFs are definately not the best VHFs in the game, so the corresponding deficiency in their class 9 guns should be corrected. I'm afraid that considering the Reinlanders have some of the best ships in the mod, having the best weapons in the mod is just overkill and either the ships or the weapons should be toned down. Other than those glaring problems I would need to look more closely at the ships themselves to make any other comments. And of course, all balancing techniques that look at both gun and ship at the same time assume a person is role playing sincerely and using appropriate equipment.

If you think I've overlooked an aspect of weapon performance in this analysis, please post it here.

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[AU]Anton_Blix
-Signature by Doom

[Asymptotic]

Except with shield-killers, hull damage is always twice the shield damage.

ALWAYS. NO EXCEPTIONS.

You might want to revise your list.

[Malaclypse 666]

Except with shield-killers, hull damage is always twice the shield damage.

ALWAYS. NO EXCEPTIONS.

You might want to revise your list.

..you might want to have your dyslexia checked.

They're called "shield-busters", because they do more damage to shields than hull.

There's your exception.

Please review your review.

Thanks.

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[Virus]

What's this about Rheinland weapons being unbalanced? What are you on about? Rheinland has only five forward firing guns. Liberty has six, plus a turret, and Kusari has six. It seems fair that the Rheinland vessels have a little extra damage.

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Into the Maelstrom - A Measure of Salvation - Reaver Company Database

[Qunitinius~Verginix]

Very handy list, Igiss can use this to do some tweaking. BUt I will agree with Virus, the Rheinland ship only has 5 forward firing points, it would seam fair they would get some better equipment.

Verginix Out

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[onca]

The same argument could be made for Rogues, where Werewolf/hound has only 5 forward guns.... But Sammael is among the worst guns.

@Yngen: Thanks for your effort, it's a good list:)

[Yngen]

Onca...Samael is the best class 9 gun I looked at...high hull and sheild damage, medium power consumption, high accuracy. And if the Rogue fighters only have 5 forward guns, that would be why its the best. Maybe you should have read the owners manual before you took them out to the shooting range? :lol:

Virus and Verg-notice the part I put in the analysis about how some weapons are designed with certain ships in mind...the Reinland weapons might be in that area, since i didn't have the time to go through and compare the faction weapons with their corresponding ships its good to think like that. However the more I think about it, the more I think the Firekiss is ok the way it is, mainly because its such a pain to be accurate with.

If the Firekiss and the Samael both are overpowered on purpose because their corresponding ships have fewer gun mounts, the Samael should be given some sort of achilles heel like the Firekiss's poor accuracy, otherwise its pretty much in a class by itself.

I'm getting the implication from you guys that the opposite is true for Liberty and Kusari (who have the worst guns.) Ok, so they have 6 guns, but what about all the other factions with 6 gun fighters? Why are their weapons so much better than Liberty and Kusaris-certainly not because they have the best fighters?

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[AU]Anton_Blix
-Signature by Doom

[Qunitinius~Verginix]

The were wolf really does need to have the good gunbs though. AS AShonhurst today I took a mission for the outcasts in Beta. I didn't even mange to Kill ONE of the NPC eagles before they defiled my remains. That thing turns so damn slow....

I should say, leave the Firekiss and Samael where they are, cause the corresponding ships need them.

Verginix Out

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[Symbol]

Ya know, one thing you must take into the cdonsideration is weapon speed, them firekisses are extremely slow if i remember correctly, 500ish speed. You wouldnt kill anything with them even if they did 2k hull damage

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<span style="font-family:Arial Black"><span style="color:#FF0000">[X]-BlueBeard-[X]</span> - Pirate!
? - Corsair!
[M]-AcE-[M] - Merc who doesnt get paid enough!
??? </span> - Military!

[pchwang]

The Samaels are fine. It's almost impossible to concentrate fire for long periods of time with them.

I do have slight problem with the Vengeance mk 5 though. 186 Hull and 93 Shield? Slightly low if you ask me...

Oh and Yngen, btw, your cart is incorrect in some areas. The Samael does not do 640 damage per second.

The Samael does 210 hull per shot, and its rf rate is 8.33. To calculate the damage done per second you multiply 210 by 8. And that is only if all 8 shots hit the target.

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[7:42:05 PM][6:51:36 PM] Igor (Smokey): btw terry
[6:51:48 PM] Terrance Cooper: Ye?
[6:52:00 PM] Igor (Smokey): nothin
[6:52:03 PM] Igor (Smokey): just sayin btw
[6:52:05 PM] Terrance Cooper: &lt;_&lt;

Johnny_Haas: you shot anti criuse speed rockets!!!
Johnny_Haas: but why????
Johnny_Haas: ??
Johnny_Haas: why you shoot criuse speed rockets?