Destroying slaver transports

[Salvador.P]

Note: the intention of this thread is not to flame any faction, but to discuss the morale of destroying slaver transports. The bellow scenario is just one of many possible.

Here's a classic scenario: Pilgrim Series Slave Liner jumps into Tau-23 system, its cargo hold full of slaves (3900). As the liner approaches the Tau-37 JH a group of =CR= fighters & bombers closes in on the slaver from Java base. The way is blocked, CD are being fired upon the transport and the ship is basically a sitting duck. He refuses to drop the slaves off on the FP 10 or into space. Colonials blow the slaver transport up and its cargo (slaves) is floating in space.

Now, it's easy to RP it that the slaves are alive & well, enjoying the space walk, but IMO, that's very far from realistic scenario. Just imagine what would happen if a big ship full of people would really blow up. Those slaves are crammed into their holding cells, they have no escape pods. When the fires and explosions start, with life support and artificial gravity failing, slaves become minced meat. What floats in space, after the transport is destroyed, are not alive slaves, safely tucked in their escape pods, but dismembered corpses. Even if you order a slaver to drop those slaves into space, you sentence them to cold & quick death. The temperature of space is -273 C. One could survive that only in a space suit/escape pod (fighter pilots).

There is no doubt about the depravity of slavers or of those who support them. No doubt at all! But what about the so-called noble "space knights" who destroy transports full of slaves and kill thousands of innocent lives? They claim their motives are noble. That may be so, but what about the results of their actions? One could argue that if they had let the slaver transport pass, the slaves would have died on cardamine plantations anyway, so it really makes no difference. Well, perhaps not in the game, but lets not forget that this is a role-play community where we try to mimic real life. I don't know about you, but in real life, I would never ever ever think about blowing up a transport full of people. That is pure terrorism. No law-abiding group of people would resort to that.

A suggestion: to let the slaver transport pass is not an option, of course. If the captain refuses to let the slaves free on the nearest lawful base, you may choose to do one of the following:

• bring transport's hull down to 10%, or to critical, and persuade him to give you his cargo
  
• shoot off all of his weapons & equipment
  
• put a nice bounty on the slaver
  
• destroy the slaver's ship next time he passes you with any other kind of cargo
  
• (open to suggestions / your input)
  

[jshkornmiller]

I agree with you, if this is a Role play server. we're to play the role of REAL people.
this is the way i see it:

A van tries to cross the U.S. / Mexican border. The van is transporting 20 illegal immigrants plus the driver. The cops chase them down, the van finally stops. the cop now does what?

A:] Throws a grenade into the van killing everyone for not complying to U.S. law

-or-

B:] rips open the door and demands everyone out, arrests them and takes them to the nearest processing station.



Given the common sense that i have, I'm going to say B. Now, why are the police in Freelancer going with option A? Well, to pvp whores and get that shiny blue note across their screen. they must not care about the rp that can come from interacting in a situation that you have stated. i wonder why?

[Messiah]

or admit that you are a PvP whore and stop the self-righteous act once and for all

Here you revert from your new tactic to of using 'RP' reasons get every lolcap-creating powertrader through smoothely, back to your old tactic of faction-flaming.

Your new tactic wasnt working anyway.

I personally think that escape pods cant work ALL the time, and that every sixth time you die (and thats being nice, statistically speaking), you should kill off the character. When the sixth time is will be decided using a dice, thrown by your oponent who killed you.

Two days ago, I had a liberty rogue use cruise in his cloaked escape pod to escape capture by the LSF, after he cruised 50k off the map and then blew himself up saying 'haha enjoy your trip home' to the only ship (LSF) that was near. Now there's RP at its finest!

I agree with you, if this is a Role play server. we're to play the role of REAL people.

Ohaider, Malak!
Arent you the guy that used his LPI character to move the lawfuls out of Texas, so you could swap ships and move your slave trader through there? One time, you even told the last LPI in Texas that you are *insert LPI char name* so they would let you pass. That was awesome RP there too.

Ok you convinced me. Let make the cardi route risk free. Someone RPing as someone oposed to slavery and not accepting a bribe to let the slavers pass is really horrible.

On a sidenote, most of the slavers let themselves be blown up on purpose because they dont wanna fly all the way back.

[jshkornmiller]

Ohaider, Malak!
Arent you the guy that used his LPI character to move the lawfuls out of Texas, so you could swap ships and move your slave trader through there? One time, you even told the last LPI in Texas that you are *insert LPI char name* so they would let you pass. That was awesome RP there too.

okay, nice burn, but that was over a year ago so meh. i am no longer in the LPI and i no longer have a smuggler actually, i have no characters of any interest atm besides a bank character with all my money on it. But you missed the point.

You're killing innocent people here, yes, the captain is wrong, but you need to attempt to save the lives of the slaves. just because they are labels as contraband it doesn't actually mean they are cargo, they're human lives.

you would kill slaves because they're in a slave ship with outcast or some over random tag?

[Salvador.P]

Messiah, you completely missed my poin with the following:

Ok you convinced me. Let make the cardi route risk free.

I never said that. In fact, if it was safe, I'd probably switch to another one out of boredom. But that's no the point. The point is the ethic question: are those who destroy transports full of slaves really innocent and pure, or are they of the same murderous breed as slavers?!

[Wuselkobold]

On a sidenote, most of the slavers let themselves be blown up on purpose because they dont wanna fly all the way back.

This

I deal with slavers daily in ZAS and this is exactely what happens in 80 % of all interdictions. Either they don't answer, try to run without a word, open fire or say 'kill me'
Other 10% thrust to the next base (Barrier Gate), dock and start to RP after they are safe. Great.

As valid as the OPs arguments are, both sides have to play along. And I just can't see any Slaver agree to drop all his cargo.
If we played along with your proposal, we'd need to let 8 out of 10 slavers pass unharmed.

In Addition: The game mechanics don't allow us to stop and board a slaver vessel, no matter how much Spaceship crew (marines) and light arms we might have as RP commodities on our ships. If the slaver player doesn't play along, we are doomed to fail.

So, if you have any ideas how we could actuallyfree any slaves without blowing the slaver up, tell me, I'm really eager to hear them.

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A wild goose chase (RP story)

[Marcus Lindberg]

I always RP that the conditions on a Slave Liner are so bad, everyone has to wear space suits in order to survive, therefore if a ship like that was blown up, all the slaves (in space suits) would probably survive.

Besides, with so much activity in space anyways, space suits are probably really cheap, in fact their probably considered normal clothes (in space ans space stations at least).

Hell...theres probably even a space suit pageant :/

[Messiah]

If you stick around in the system where the CR had to blow up a slave liner (because he prefered being blown up over saving his life and having to make his way to where ever), you will witness the following:

-All the cargo is still in space after a ship explodes. No cargo is destroyed by the explosion. No slaves are killed.

-The CR will organize a transport to tractor in the slaves and drop them off at falkland or Freeport 9 or Minato.

-If a CR shoots the cargo 'to destroy the contrabande slaves' (which actually happened once with a new recruit), he will be court martialled, severely.

Also, the CR and ZOners against slavery dont destroy the ship entirely. They only blow up its drives. They dont shoot at the cramped slave containers. Duh?

Any more questions?

[Salvador.P]

I deal with slavers daily in ZAS and this is exactely what happens in 80 % of all interdictions. Either they don't answer, try to run without a word, open fire or say 'kill me'
Other 10% thrust to the next base (Barrier Gate), dock and start to RP after they are safe. Great.

Yes, sadly that's also the case.

All the cargo is still in space after a ship explodes.

How can slaves, locked away in their cells, survive the explosion?

[Messiah]

I never said that. In fact, if it was safe, I'd probably switch to another one out of boredom.

Oh... forgot this delicious quote.

Of COURSE you would switch to another route out of boredom. I totally believe it.

But that's no the point. The point is the ethic question: are those who destroy transports full of slaves really innocent and pure, or are they of the same murderous breed as slavers?!

Murderous breed?
You made this topic in anger after blowing up, right?