' Wrote:Those yapping on about how suicide bombings are happening RIGHT NOW (zomg) should remember that there are always reasons why certain people do not get along.
For instance, why do certain people in the middle east dislike the USA?
If you can't come up with a reason other than:
1) They dislike westerners
2) They a different race
3) They are a different religion group
Then you need to learn more.
The roots of the conflict in the middle east goes back a long time, with recent history being very important too, and not so good for the western world.
Loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong time.
It's a blood feud that has lasted over three thousand years (approx).
In the end they are brothers but no one cares.
In the end we are all brothers, and some care, but it's not enough yet to make a difference in the world.
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Does that show you guys how much power you actually have? It's more than you realise. Your choices matter to this world. Make them good choices.
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Also, remember that religion is separate from the Creator. There IS a distinction. Religion is man's creation and God hates it probably more than any human does. Jesus was fighting against the religious leaders of that day, and he continues to do so today. Why shackle yourself to chains, when you can have freedom? Why do we make all these rules? Because when there are "rules" to play by, (and this relates to my previous post about conscience) we recognise justice. If things are not just or fair, then you know it. That doesn't matter what culture you come from. Justice doesn't change, and neither does love. Our interpretation of those do. THAT is what our "culture" influences. The problem happens when the rules go to far. Just like on Disco.
Usually because of a few people who don't want to play by those "rules".
Also remember that you can make a religion out of anything. (Just look at what we do for the Olympic games, or gasp...Rugby!)
Sovereign Wrote:Seek fun and you shall find it. Seek stuff to Q_Q about and you'll find that, too. I choose to have fun.
In relation to the point about justice being a more universal constant for humans (IE, everyone recognises it as Ghosty said), I have to agree.
However justice is subjective.
For instance, slaves were treated like well..slaves because they were viewed as simple animals, even more worthless than horses at times.
They were given no justice as they were not human, in the eyes of the public.
You may notice that very few countries go to war for 'bad' reasons but usually for 'good' reasons.
Even the Nazi's ideals revolved around the Germans being a master race, hence why they ought to dominate everyone else etc.
If you identify people as different than you, then justice is different for them. This is both true in the large scale cases such as slavery but also personal justice. Often people will want a criminal brought to justice, yet wouldn't want their friend brought to justice if they were that criminal.
' Wrote:Yeah, Saddam killed over 1 000 000 just with gass, another 1,5 000 000 in Iraq - Iran war, and his total bill is almost 8 000 000 civilians... yea western world is so evil oh my gooood.
By the way 500 000? Yea? And how much of them were killed by Iraqi terrorists (Zarquawi and al-Sadr for example)? Waaaaaaait I just said Iraqui terorists, not freedom fighters OMG I am being rasist on FL forum Oo
Very ironic for you to say that when the United States actually funded Saddam Hussein's regime and their war with Iran. So yes, I confirm your statement of "yea western world is so evil oh my gooood" without the sarcasm. Not to mention the fact the primary reason Iraq was invaded was because of allegations over Saddam's possession of Weapons of Mass Destruction. Now tell me, little sheep, why were none ever found after the war? Hmmm, really makes you think, doesn't it?
Also, I find your assumptions of our religious leaders' "followers" very ignorant as well as humorous.
"Just call them terrorists and your actions will be justified"- From the mind of George W. Bush and people like him
without wasting time reading 7 pages, but reading Ash's OP I'd say that the ultimate problem with religions is that they just make s*** up as they go along & sabotage themselves in the long run cause they keep making stuff up to try & re-explain outlandish mythology to conform with the constantly changing times.
Tis better to get over that & come to terms that it's all just made up fairy tales originally created to explain the unexplainable to the vastly uneducated masses of yesteryear.
::By the way, beyond my better judgment I'm gonna say what I really think...y'know, just cause someone has to sometime: I usually go with the flow & discourage talk of religion cause I know how offensive & inflammatory the subject is...but how many people here have been honest enough to say "HEY! why should we always submit to the thin-skinned pro-god brigade & relent when they get offended? Personally, I get equally offended when I'm asked to back off from the god fans & their thin skins...yet the majority of arguments that start over religion is not from the non-religious, but from the true believers who don't like to hear things that crush their reality:: ::shug:: -I now return to my normal "yeah, whatever" mode-
I will have to say this as someone who is living in a majority Islamic country and being a deist (which means I don't believe in religions).
We have terror in my country caused by a terrorist group supported by UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, supported by ISRAEL, supported by BELGIUM, supported by FRANCE as UNDER THE COUNTER AID while on the front being "cursed and flamed for being terrorists"
They kill people all the time.
All the countries who support that nation under the counterwise are NON ISLAMIC COUNTRIES.
Almost ALL terrorist groups are CONTROLLED by higher parties for their own profit and gain and such gains are OVER RELIGIOUS OR MORAL BELIEFS. The visual is simply a lie to make normal people LIKE YOU to look elsewhere. How sad it is to see that they succeed and CONGRATULATIONS, you are a WINNER by being NO:1 to believe such things!!!
For GODS SAKE, please at least be a bit intelligent to check more than what you see at the first page of your Google search, then talk.
Half of the world is sure and another half of the rest is almost sure that what has happened in US was a pre-staged drama by their own government to be able to move on their next level of scheme in Afghanistan and Iraq, now Iran.
Islam is not as tolerant as the Christianity but THAT IS NOT BECAUSE THE RELIGION IS FLAWED, its simply, Christianity is a better marketted mass religion.
Every religion is regional in origin, they create the auto control mechanisms according to regional dominance first. They spread over time inevitably but the main arrays of setups are done according to the initial "ground zero" situations.
TO BE SINCERE, if you had some power in your hands other than a keyboard, I guess you would be as dangerous and disasterous to world as Adolf Hitler with such an epic fail mindframe and thanks to GOD if there is ever one, that you don't have such a power. @ evil.
You can be a sheep, a sheep-dog, a shepherd, a wolf, or a regular human that goes about his day. Don't worry about the problems of others.
A way a lone a last a loved a long the riverrun, past Eve and Adam's, from swerve of shore to bend of bay,
brings us by a commodius vicus of recirculation back to Howth Castle and Environs.
' Wrote:without wasting time reading 7 pages, but reading Ash's OP I'd say that the ultimate problem with religions is that they just make s*** up as they go along & sabotage themselves in the long run cause they keep making stuff up to try & re-explain outlandish mythology to conform with the constantly changing times.
Tis better to get over that & come to terms that it's all just made up fairy tales originally created to explain the unexplainable to the vastly uneducated masses of yesteryear.
Retroactive continuity.
A way a lone a last a loved a long the riverrun, past Eve and Adam's, from swerve of shore to bend of bay,
brings us by a commodius vicus of recirculation back to Howth Castle and Environs.
Ever read the sword of truth series by terry goodkind?
Wizard's First Rule: People can be made to believe any lie, either because they want it to be true or because they fear it might be.
That's how religious control works - they either use false hopes or promises of damnation to keep people in line. A lot of people have blind faith, partly because they were raised that way by their parents, and they will believe anything the church says without question. Unfortunately in many countries around the world, those people are the rule and not the exception.
More modern countries are starting to see some dissent and rejection of the church (whatever religion it may promote), but the people who actually decide to think for themselves are still pretty rare in comparison to those who let religion think for them.
I always urge people to see reason regarding religion - that none of it is truly 'real', but all of it was created to serve as a moral or ethical guideline for the people - but it rarely takes. I'm dumbfounded at how some people can actually think that every person on the planet was descended from two humans named Adam and Eve, but some people take it as a literal story rather than seeing that the whole thing is just a lesson in "dont take more than what you need - dont be greedy".
Anyways, I'll stop myself there, I can go on for hours about religious debate >.>
I was raised by my parents as an atheist. When I grew up, I converted to Islam. I choose to believe in it because it makes sense and it's a wonderful way of life. There is no clergy in my religion. In the the Qur'an it states that you don't have to be Muslim to go to heaven and that "72 virgins" thing is absolute rubbish. It pisses me off when people attack a religion when it seems they didn't take the time to do the most basic of research. When the media brainwashes them to a point where their opinions are exact mirrors of the ignorant bigots they listen to.