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+--- Thread: Am I missing some rules? (/showthread.php?tid=95691)
RE: Am I missing some rules? - Agmen of Eladesor - 03-19-2013
Should he have told you that he was going to report you? No - that in and of itself is a rule 3.4 violation. However, because you were grouped with the other guy, the same rules that apply when lawful and unlawful forces group together to take out a base would also apply.
In other words, you did violate 1.2, even in it was unintentional. Technically there's nothing in the rules that say that a pirate can't stop someone, collect money from him, and then still blow him up. It's ALSO a dick move, and I guarantee you that if reported, you'd get sanctioned. Same thing applies here - you (effectively, since it was you and your partner because you were grouped) had already pirated him in that system. You had already had your Player vs Player encounter in that system with this guy, and whoever you were grouped with should have shared his loot with you.
Now - different set of circumstances - say he's hauling from Bretonia to Rheinland and back again. You pirate him in Omega 3 as he's leaving Bretonia. He pays. He leaves the system, goes to New Berlin, dumps his cargo, reloads and comes back through. Feel free to pirate him again - in those circumstances they're two different encounters.
RE: Am I missing some rules? - tothebonezone - 04-07-2013
I'll be honest. Traders and miners are entitled. And the majority of them are as dumb as a sack of bricks.
You can't believe the rage I've gotten over the last two days for asking people for voluntary donations. And then they blow a gasket when you disrupt them for trying to cruise past you silently.
As long as it's not a super dick move, like pirating them in rapid succession as a group, or pirating and blowing them up, they're free game.
It's not my fault you've flown down my lane that I haven't moved from for three hours, haulers. Six or seven times you've taken the same lane. If you're going to try and whizz by with your load of gold ore without saying a word, we're gonna have a problem.
RE: Am I missing some rules? - Hone - 04-08-2013
(03-19-2013, 04:03 PM)Agmen of Eladesor Wrote: Should he have told you that he was going to report you? No - that in and of itself is a rule 3.4 violation. However, because you were grouped with the other guy, the same rules that apply when lawful and unlawful forces group together to take out a base would also apply.
In other words, you did violate 1.2, even in it was unintentional. Technically there's nothing in the rules that say that a pirate can't stop someone, collect money from him, and then still blow him up. It's ALSO a dick move, and I guarantee you that if reported, you'd get sanctioned. Same thing applies here - you (effectively, since it was you and your partner because you were grouped) had already pirated him in that system. You had already had your Player vs Player encounter in that system with this guy, and whoever you were grouped with should have shared his loot with you.
Now - different set of circumstances - say he's hauling from Bretonia to Rheinland and back again. You pirate him in Omega 3 as he's leaving Bretonia. He pays. He leaves the system, goes to New Berlin, dumps his cargo, reloads and comes back through. Feel free to pirate him again - in those circumstances they're two different encounters.
I disagree. For one thing, you dont have to let someone leave the system after you pirate them, say he takes a lane drops off his cargo, picks up some more, and comes back, Id pirate him again. Second seeing as the other guy pirated him Id say theres no effect on him. He didnt get paid the first time the guy got pirated.
Third I dont understand your base analogy, Wouldnt lawfuls and unlawfuls grouping up be sanctioned for oorp alliance? And besides I dont think bases are effected by the 4 or 2 (which is it these days) hour rule?
RE: Am I missing some rules? - Agmen of Eladesor - 04-08-2013
(04-08-2013, 01:46 AM)Hone Wrote:(03-19-2013, 04:03 PM)Agmen of Eladesor Wrote: In other words, you did violate 1.2, even in it was unintentional. Technically there's nothing in the rules that say that a pirate can't stop someone, collect money from him, and then still blow him up. It's ALSO a dick move, and I guarantee you that if reported, you'd get sanctioned. Same thing applies here - you (effectively, since it was you and your partner because you were grouped) had already pirated him in that system. You had already had your Player vs Player encounter in that system with this guy, and whoever you were grouped with should have shared his loot with you.
Now - different set of circumstances - say he's hauling from Bretonia to Rheinland and back again. You pirate him in Omega 3 as he's leaving Bretonia. He pays. He leaves the system, goes to New Berlin, dumps his cargo, reloads and comes back through. Feel free to pirate him again - in those circumstances they're two different encounters.
I disagree. For one thing, you dont have to let someone leave the system after you pirate them, say he takes a lane drops off his cargo, picks up some more, and comes back, Id pirate him again. Second seeing as the other guy pirated him Id say theres no effect on him. He didnt get paid the first time the guy got pirated.
Third I dont understand your base analogy, Wouldnt lawfuls and unlawfuls grouping up be sanctioned for oorp alliance? And besides I dont think bases are effected by the 4 or 2 (which is it these days) hour rule?
Technically, we're not disagreeing on one thing. I simply meant in my example that he was going from one place to the other. On the other hand, if you want to pirate someone as they're taking the lane into New Tokyo (as an example) and then when the come out of the planet with a different cargo, you probably could (but that would still be a dick move).
However, you're not right the other way. Say for example you're Pirate A, and you're grouped with Pirate B - and it can be SEEN by looking at the player list that you're grouped. You sit at the entrance to Omega 3 from Bretonia, your compadre is sitting at the exit from Omega 3 to Omega 7. That's evidence you're working together, and if you BOTH pirate the guy, that's a 1.2, because he's already (effectively) been pirated by you once and paid. If you're grouped, then you're considered one unit, no matter HOW many people are in that group.
That's one of the reasons the people in that massive base assault got sanctioned - they became one GROUP. You can have mutual enemies not shoot at each other if they're working to take out a common enemy - for example, the BHG|Core will work WITH the Order when a Nomad shows up (sometimes), or with the Corsairs if we get another ZonerZonerZoner thing going. That's not OORP. But we don't group together - that is what makes it a 1.2 violation.
EDIT: Go re-read what Jinx said, above. He also explained it pretty well.
RE: Am I missing some rules? - Amon.Cire - 04-08-2013
Thank you everyone for your input in this thread, it has helped to clear up a lot server rule nuances for me.
RE: Am I missing some rules? - Hone - 04-08-2013
Id say its a different sanction for the base, because those IDs arnt allowed to ally with each other, so that's why they got sanctioned. Whereas there's nothing OORP about a pirate giving info on incoming traders to his buddy. SO I still disagree, and say its fine to pirate someone who got pirated by someone else in your group, as long as you didnt take part in the first one. Perfectly INRP hunting strategy that would be used in real life. Reading Junx' one, Id say that the trader would be the idiot for continuing in that situation, when he should call the cops to clear the GC blokade.
RE: Am I missing some rules? - blubba - 04-08-2013
So if the miner, after being pirated decides to stay in that field and continue mining, he's in the clear from that pirate group because he paid?
A trader would afterall be on his toes and be gone sharpish....but a miner?
So How long would he be able to remain in that system mining and unmolested by the original group?
RE: Am I missing some rules? - Hone - 04-08-2013
By rules you can be pirated once per radar contact, so if he stays there after hes paid the pirate, hes running his own risk of the pirate coming back, finding him still there and pirating him again. If a pirate lets you go, you might wanna take tht chance to get out of there and call the police. however when i was Mollying around pirating miners in du, Id call it a tax, and give them 12 hours or till they left the system "citizenship" and even come to their aid if another non molly pirated them. But thats cos molly RP involves claiming ownership of dublin, not just as common pirates, and it differs from person to person.
RE: Am I missing some rules? - Champ - 04-10-2013
(04-08-2013, 11:41 PM)Hone Wrote: By my interpretation of the rules you can be pirated once per radar contact,
I fixed that for you, because that's not the way the rules are written.
Downedit: My apologies for not knowing of the post you're talking about. Feel free to reference it.
RE: Am I missing some rules? - Hone - 04-10-2013
Your right, I shouldn't have said by rules, i should have said "By green word of admin" as thats where Im getting it from, in one of the hundreds of other threads on this topic, in the bowels of this forum.