Zoner RP Solutions

[bluntpencil2001]

You could try negotiating, after all. Nobody made any real attempts at this besides making hefty demands and screaming like spoiled children.

And why would your Freeports in the back and beyond get destroyed? I thought you had a fleet capable of threatening a whole House?

You can't have the best of both worlds. You're either a superpower, or you're not. You can't be a superpower only when it benefits you.

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[jammi]

if zoners are so detrimental for the gameplay of all factions around - we can SERIOUSLY suggest it to igiss. - swap alliances. turn zoners into an army. - an edgeworld army.

Well, for starters think about a Zoner army. There is no coordination because you're not a military, meaning you have no ranks (ranks being something the Zoners would probably find abhorrent - personal freedom of anarchists and all that). You get coordination from ranks and chain of command. Without ranks command falls to a ship's captain and what he or she thought was the best choice - not beneficial for tactical cohesion.

Added to the fact that as Zoners, you have no military training due to your self-imposed neutrality (no enemies, no training) you're given a result that looks more than a little alike green combat crews that are going to be decimated by any tactically sound and militarily organised and trained force.

Plus you've got a sprawl of stations spanning most of Sirius. Yes Zoner fleets are big, but they're not big enough to cover all their ground. You'd have to cluster fleets around Gran Canaria and other vital stations, which leaves the opportunistic vultures that are the rest of Sirius to swoop on the undefended ports.

Sure, fleets could be redeployed as needed, but for any real chance of a timely and effective redeployment, you need tactical cohesion (see first paragraph), which just isn't happening. When a fleet redeploys that also opens a chink in the armour elsewhere - giving more vultures room to swoop.

Aggressive Zoners are infeasible. You're too spread out and untrained.

3: ok,then not lolcaps,but all the capital ships sitting in gamma

Same thing.

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[DAnvilFan]

If a hotel let terrorists and murderers in and shot cops that tried to take them away, they'd get in trouble.

Letting murderers resupply in your bases is making you an accomplice to murder, since you know fine what they get up to.

Corsair: Hey, I have some diamonds to sell! Got any food to exchange it for?
Zoner: Sure! Where did you get the diamonds?
Corsair: I found them LOL

In Zoner eyes, everybody is a terrorist, everybody is a cop, and everybody has their reasons for doing this or that. When QCP comes near Gran Canaria and tries to tax and fire on Corsairs we do not see it as "cops shooting at terrorists," we see it as, "group A shooting at group B in OUR turf."

We're sorry that you're having such a hell of a hard time with this concept, but there it is. Some Zoners care in one region (like Zoners against Slavery), but most Zoners couldn't give a flying ---- about this or that. Humanitarian aid to Corsairs and others is only provided by about 5% of the entire Zoner player base.

You can't have the best of both worlds. You're either a superpower, or you're not. You can't be a superpower only when it benefits you.

Zoners are like native american tribes with big guns. Individually they're pretty weak and most do what they want. When a Freeport gets nuked, they come together. Should Zoners have giant warships? Realistically, probably not, but somebody put them in Disco eaons ago and they're bound to be used. Folks like OSI and ZTC almost exclusivly fly Eagles and Rocs so a lot of the Caps come from non-faction players.

[bluntpencil2001]

In Zoner eyes, everybody is a terrorist, everybody is a cop, and everybody has their reasons for doing this or that. When QCP comes near Gran Canaria and tries to tax and fire on Corsairs we do not see it as "cops shooting at terrorists," we see it as, "group A shooting at group B in OUR turf."

We're sorry that you're having such a hell of a hard time with this concept, but there it is. Some Zoners care in one region (like Zoners against Slavery), but most Zoners couldn't give a flying ---- about this or that. Humanitarian aid to Corsairs and others is only provided by about 5% of the entire Zoner player base.

If everyone is a terrorist, lock your bloody doors, I say.

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[DAnvilFan]

Once more. Everybody kills everybody. As long as people don't terrorize Zoners, they don't care. The difference between terrorists and cops is non-existant to most Zoners because to them its just groups killing each other.

You want to kill each other? By all means, go ahead. Zoners don't care as long as you do it 5k away from their bases. This isn't to say that one Zoner here and there won't stand up and say, "Slavery is an outrage and I will kill every Slaver who comes my way," but that's the individuality aspect of Zoners. Most, however, don't care one way or the other.

[bluntpencil2001]

When a Freeport gets nuked, they come together

When a Freeport gets nuked, the survivors end up on Planet Manhattan. They then do nothing.

See: Freeport 7

Once more. Everybody kills everybody. As long as people don't terrorize Zoners, they don't care. The difference between terrorists and cops is non-existant to most Zoners because to them its just groups killing each other.

You want to kill each other? By all means, go ahead. Zoners don't care as long as you do it 5k away from their bases. This isn't to say that one Zoner here and there won't stand up and say, "Slavery is an outrage and I will kill every Slaver who comes my way," but that's the individuality aspect of Zoners. Most, however, don't care one way or the other.

Not good enough. If a terrorist is on your base, I'm going to go get the bastard.

Hell, America needed less reasoning to invade Iraq. Zoners actually DO have pirates and terrorists in their ports, even letting them colonise in 49.

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[Magoo!]

If everyone is a terrorist, lock your bloody doors, I say.

This would be the perfect opportunity for me to say, "I'll take that as a, 'I have no counter, so I'll say something witty' ". But since I have some sense of debate-based maturity, I'll pass the chance up.

Added to the fact that as Zoners, you have no military training due to your self-imposed neutrality (no enemies, no training) you're given a result that looks more than a little alike green combat crews that are going to be decimated by any tactically sound and militarily organised and trained force.

Well, I like to think that killing Aliens which destroyed Sol and threatened to wipe Sirius clean of humanity is pretty good training. And, well, besides that the ZTC 'trains' regularly. OSI fighters and bombers decimate most things that cross their snouts.

In theory, we have nothing besides a bunch of traders, but in reality, we have quite a fighting force. Or at least based on player skill. Purely speaking RP wise, you're right, we're probably about as deadly as a wet noodle, but there's got to be a reason why we've survived in the middle of nowhere for as long as we have. I mean, if we were such pushovers, the Corsairs probably would have taken over our stations long ago. Them or somebody else.

[DAnvilFan]

Jesus you're just full of witty remarks, are you? You're just the wittiest person ever.

You have issues with Zoners flying Juggs? You take it up with the mod developers. The roleplay behind Zoners is that they are still individuals with many different communities that think differently. But yes, they have access to super large warships. C'est la vie. When a base gets threatened, those warships get together. It's really quite simple.

I don't fly a capital ship and never will, but you can't stop others from doing it when 2 destroyers and 2 battleships have been put in the game years ago.

Not good enough. If a terrorist is on your base, I'm going to go get the bastard.

Like I said, by all means go ahead. But if you do it in the FNZ you are marked as an enemy. I'm not going to try to convince you not to do it. That's up to your character. But that's how it rolls.

[Benjamin]

Stop throwing your toys out of your pram. There's a difference between powergamed neutrality and ganking everyone with juggernauts.

Ever noticed how all the actual corporations have a whole bunch of enemies each, but they don't even have caps, let alone a desire to attach them all to their house military and go invade the pirates homes?

You're acting like children.

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[jammi]

In theory, we have nothing besides a bunch of traders, but in reality, we have quite a fighting force. Or at least based on player skill. Purely speaking RP wise, you're right, we're probably about as deadly as a wet noodle, but there's got to be a reason why we've survived in the middle of nowhere for as long as we have. I mean, if we were such pushovers, the Corsairs probably would have taken over our stations long ago. Them or somebody else.

It's called Igiss.

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