Hogosha in NY

[El Nino]

As long as he didnt do anything illegal and was not carrying contraband, the liberty lawfuls have no reason to attack him. Xenos/rogues/outcasts/hackers/junkers on the other hand can attack him outright.

Signed...

:lol:But going to NY is risky, if you want to preserve your RP, or so I noticed. I was attacked by an LSF Pretorian for god's sake. Fortunatly I got my shields and took a shortcut to Kusari space.

It seems strange to me how the official authority there (LN) understood my visit, and freelancing people didn't...

Also Hogosha and Junkers are a lot diffrent. Junkers are more salvagers smugglers and such. Hogosha is a Quasi-Legal house crime organisation. They are much more powerful in Kusari space than Junkers will be anywhere...

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[song]

It actually is. In RP Hogosha smuggles Artifacts in Kusari, not in Liberty.
Since prices are not very well balanced, Artifacts are pretty cheap in Kusari.
So if you want to stay in RP you have to accept lousy profit.

I hope 4.85 will bring us some astronomic prices for Artifacts in Kusari.

And Culebra, that is because Junker power is not massed in one place (House), like Hogosha's is.
But I wouldn't consider a Hogosha character landing on Liberty bases in RP. I don't like it at all.
Junkers are very strong in Liberty and Liberty is not a place to be for a Hogosha.

As I said, once the prices for artifacts are upped, there will be no reason whatsoever for Hogosha to visit Liberty. Ever.

Yeah--but selling artifacts in Liberty gives real plausibility to one of the reasons Junkers hate Hogosha--its competition (same for their synth marijuana).

This is one of those "happy coincidences" where the mod elements actually reinforce role play. If Junkers are banned and shot by EVERYONE in Kusari then Hogosha are no better or worse than any other Kusari group to Junkers. If Hogosha then don't sell any competing products and never enter any Junker core space, where's the big threat and why all the hatred? Sure Hogosha are already 'criminals" in Kusari at the moment but their sales markets are outside Kusari--which also would explain why Kusari authorities don't mind looking the other way towards drug traffic that is going away from Kusari to gaijin--less problem for Kusari.

Right now one of the two best prices for synthetic marijuana sold at the Hogosha base is in liberty. the best artifact price is there. That traffic would cause a conflict with Junkers and Hogosha and along with natural Kusari prejudice would be enough to really create conflict between Junkers and Hogosha.

We seem to keep trending towards two-dimensionalize every faction so we have black and white rules to define every single thing they do--what ship they can fly, what guns and gun mixes they can use, what items they can carry and where they can and can't go--it's getting towards micro degrees in some cases and that doesn't make better role play.

It SHOULD be a "turf war" between Junkers and Hogosha. It SHOULD be risky (with Junkers) to take goods for a Hogosha to Liberty

To Liberty rank and file, Hogosha are just "another Kusari"--they aren't going to be deeply steeped in all their inner workings. Even though liberty authorities might realize they are a source of contraband, they also can conduct legitimate trade and there is no way for them to say "all Hogosha are criminals--Kusari prejudice allows that towards Junkers--but that isn't a typical Libertonian demeanor (heck, they tolerate criminal Junkers in their backyard).

We want Gaians only flying around their base, hogosha parked close to New Tokyo--etc., etc. because they are "small" factions--and its easy to minimalise them and confine them when we dismiss them as unimportant. Every faction ought to have some real playability in the game and not be a place holder.

It would be a shame to see some of these factions locked away in a tiny closet of confined play only. The other thread mentioned how few kusari and hogosha players there are overall and I can tell you why. people look and go, "Hmm, all their role play is just in Kusari" and then say, "Naah" and then go play a more open, fun and varied faction.

Also, as i stated elsewhere, the Hogosha in Kusari are looked at just as any other company. They are treated like a houise corporation. There is no reason an ambitious Hogosha company wouldn't smuggle to lucrative markets outside kusari--especially when authorities are willing to look the other way in Kusari when they do so.

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<span style="font-family:System">Hogosha Exile</span>
The Journal of Benjo Dokosai

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[chopper]

Shigeo Kitamura, we'r talking about two different things.
You are talking about how it is now, which I agree with.
I'm talking about how it should be, by the RP story.
Hogosha are not smugglers into Liberty, they smuggle from Hawaii to Kabukicho.

As for their conflict with Junkers.
Well, I see it a bit different.
Junkers want in Kusari, Hogosha won't let them, so there's a conflict.
Hogosha sees them as competition, not the other way around.
Junkers do control every unlawful market in the rest of Sirius, but they are missing Kusari to become sirius wide organization.
That's why they hate Hogosha.
Hogosha hate them because they see them as a threat, and thus they are hostile.

I didn't say that Liberty lawful forces would engage them in Liberty.
Junkers are not that powerful, they don't have the connections in Liberty government like Hogosha has in Kusari.
But Junkers themselves are a danger in Liberty space, and I doubt Hogosha would just start smuggling into Liberty before actually going into a war with Junkers.
I believe that there should be a war for market first, really.

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Can't let you bash folks in your sig Chopper-Del

[Blodo]

Yeah--but selling artifacts in Liberty gives real plausibility to one of the reasons Junkers hate Hogosha--its competition (same for their synth marijuana).

This is one of those "happy coincidences" where the mod elements actually reinforce role play. If Junkers are banned and shot by EVERYONE in Kusari then Hogosha are no better or worse than any other Kusari group to Junkers. If Hogosha then don't sell any competing products and never enter any Junker core space, where's the big threat and why all the hatred? Sure Hogosha are already 'criminals" in Kusari at the moment but their sales markets are outside Kusari--which also would explain why Kusari authorities don't mind looking the other way towards drug traffic that is going away from Kusari to gaijin--less problem for Kusari.

It's the other way around. The Hogosha view the Junkers as a threat, and want to keep them out of Kusari. The Junkers on the other hand simply don't give a rats arse, they just want profit. They won't go out of their way to kill Hogosha, since they're not ideologically motivated. Unless it's in a Junker's own interest to attack a Hogosha, he probably won't (or shouldn't anyways).

Also just to note this: I agree with Chopper, Hogosha shouldn't smuggle artifacts to Liberty. They don't care about Liberty, they care about Kusari. They're the Yakuza, not decentralised entrepreneurs like Junkers are. Since the prices in Kusari for artifacts are nothing short of OORP right now, I figure it could be let to slide, but if they get fixed then Hogosha really shouldn't even be out of Kusari unless it's for a really good reason. They wouldn't want to be either.

At least that's how I see it.

It would be a shame to see some of these factions locked away in a tiny closet of confined play only. The other thread mentioned how few kusari and hogosha players there are overall and I can tell you why. people look and go, "Hmm, all their role play is just in Kusari" and then say, "Naah" and then go play a more open, fun and varied faction.

The only non-corporate factions that aren't confined to a single house are Outcasts, Corsairs, Junkers and BHG. It's a non argument. The reason why Hogosha enjoy so little attention is because people view them from a pvp perspective. It's exactly the same reason why standard Junker factions aren't exactly on the high rise either. There's not that many enemies and/or you need to learn the complex (and possibly quite skewed) diplomacy that comes with the faction. It either goes past unnoticed, or people get bored with it quickly.

In fact, most people just join the faction that has the most pvp, which would be the house military factions or the outcasts/corsairs. Not that it's a bad thing, but it's something that is easily noticable.

[Culebra]

Hogosha sees them as competition, not the other way around.
Junkers do control every unlawful market in the rest of Sirius, but they are missing Kusari to become sirius wide organization.
That's why they hate Hogosha.
Hogosha hate them because they see them as a threat, and thus they are hostile.

It's the other way around. The Hogosha view the Junkers as a threat, and want to keep them out of Kusari. The Junkers on the other hand simply don't give a rats arse, they just want profit. =

Basically what these two guys said. I don't see why Hogosha would even be in Liberty.

Hogosha are not a threat to Junker interests because the Hogosha care about Kusari. When the Junkers tried to get in on the arifact action in Kusari the Hogosha reacted.

[Linkus]

The Hogosha themselves do not smuggle to Liberty. Ever. It's done through a long chain of hands, usually ending in the Rogues.

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Facilitating the rise of robotics since 0 A.D.

[Blodo]

Linkus: Though I think it actually only applies to the vanilla FL universe and not Discovery, since Rogues are Outcast aligned here and smuggle cardi instead. Which is actually a funny thing since nobody except Junkers should realistically smuggle artifacts into Liberty. On the other hand every unlawful faction there (with the exception of Xenos) deals in cardamine. If it wasn't for the fact that Rogues would lose access to Outcast ships, I would say make them sit on the fence of the Outcast/Corsair war again, since then they could deal in both artifacts and cardi.

[Dusty Lens]

The Hogosha themselves do not smuggle to Liberty. Ever. It's done through a long chain of hands, usually ending in the Rogues.

The Hogosha smuggler artifacts into Liberty vicariously through the Rogues O_o

One of the largest barriers to Hogosha hogoshing about is that the market in Kusari, in relation to their partners in crime the Corsais, is borked beyond measure. There is only one viable trade route between the two and that's moving synthpot to Yarren... Without much worth bringing back.

As it stands, smuggling artifacts into Kusari is a pointless gesture due to the artifacts already being sold there, the trade run nets something like 30 credits per second.

[Linkus]

Oh dear now I'm confused

The Hogosha smuggler artifacts into Liberty vicariously through the Rogues O_o

If that's a serious statement then yus, that's what I meant:PIn RP anywho. Though there are some change of hands along the way. Or use to anyway.

If the junkers are the sole suppliers of artifacts for Liberty then they really ought to actually sell them on Rochester. At a price very near to Manhatten's though.

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Facilitating the rise of robotics since 0 A.D.

[ryoken]

I was the junker Guard who attacked him, and he mauled me.(colector not great against adv sheild's). I had no problem with him there. He was more in RP then the LSF in the corsair bomber, or the LN in a spacial.
Before any other lib's jump on him maybe they should look to their own first.

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