I dont care about all that stuff way back then. All im saying is things like this can happen thats why i was happy when i saw this thread this morning. Like i said to Eppy i didnt want to offend him. But that was my experiance of the things that can happen. So thats the reason i agreed with Igiss. And this is in general discussion. And i was having a genral discussion.
Quote:Is this really the place for this discussion.
No it's not. At least not in the part related to NovaPG.
Quote:I must protest. You are rendering our extremely sizable investments largely worthless so as not to impinge on the rights of minorities, yet you're placing capships in Guard systems so as not to make them as easily accessible to lolwutting morons who haven't even read the rules. You're removing the legal basis for that method's strongest pillar, the player faction!
You want to limit independent players to fighters only? Not the most logical approach. Ships placed in guard systems will at least force players to work on their reputation.
Plus, we are not talking only about Outcasts here. There are factions with far less ship-selling bases than the Outcasts. We'll think on how to do it without harming player factions' control over their systems and without restricting other players from getting the ships/weaponry they have a right to get.
Quote:The question is, can player factions restrict access to equipment and ships sold in guard systems from players of the same NPC faction?
With the exception of admin-controlled factions like Keepers, I see neither reasons nor ways to restrict this.
Quote:We'll think on how to do it without harming player factions' control over their systems and without restricting other players from getting the ships/weaponry they have a right to get.
One way would be having Player faction specific stations and general NPC faction stations in a guard system.
The Player faction would have power over their own station and whatever is sold in it etc but it would not be able to restrict purchases on the general NPC faction stations.
Both types would be in the guard system ensuring players still need to work for their reputation.
It was only ment as an example. I thought this was way past the stage of arguing about it. I niether care or even worry about it. Niether does anyone else. But seperate clans shouldnt be forced on to somone elses RP because they have been around longer or own a system. Thats was my point.
I'm afraid I disagree with some of this, notably the part about player factions being unable to limit what indies do in their own systems. As Incognito said, you're empowering the indies here; they already have the advantage of being able to choose their rank, their ship, and whatever else floats their boat; if factions lose all power, then what's the point in being limited by a player faction? Linkus made a valid suggestion, though I think the player factions should be far from the jump hole to enter the system, and the NPC stations close. That way, the players from the faction have enough time to RP with the indy a bit before he arrives and buys a capship.
THEY TOLD ME I COULD BE ANYTHING SO I BECAME A SIGNATURE PLS HLP
you should not forget that playerfactions "want" to limit themselves. - they introduced a ranking and a restriction to ranks, cause they believe its the better way .... but the emphasis lays on "they believe" - others might not.
power of a guard system is still given - within the factions basic guidelines. - so... and that was said some time ago - and repeatedly - as long as a player, factioned in a playerfaction or not, is playing by the factions rules - he cannot be denied anything, nither equipment, ships, IDs or anything.
for those that do NOT roleplay by these basic guidelines however - clans and in the last instance, admins can do something.
personally - i don t see the factions being cut off the power much - at least not more than before. - statements saying exactly what igiss said have been uttered several times before - just not "that official". factions still have the power to shape the global developement of discovery - as much as independents, mind. - just cause you have the same rights doesn t mean you have less rights than before.
so - a faction that puts a lot of efford into further developing their faction might ( if the intention and developement goes along the lines that disco is supposed to develope ) activly RP along the developement. - independents can do the same of course.
it leaves basic questions:
- should playerfactions have superior rights over non-playerfactioned players? - and if so, why or why not..
its not written anywhere that such rights are given or denied. - its a general understanding that was somewhat agreed on ( sometimes ) and sometimes it was denied. - but yes ... if that is a guideline now .... it empowers independents... but it does NOT take any rights away from playerfactions.
why should one join a playerfaction then? - that question popped up. - i DO hope that the answer to that is "cause it is a more intense and increased roleplay experience" and not "cause we have superior power and authority over others"
System-owners still have the right to enforce their own rules in their own system when it comes to characters without the proper tag and ID. I believe they're allowed to do pretty much anything to anyone, trader or otherwise, that they find, up to and including blowing them to tiny bits or placing them on a KoS list if they refuse to leave and never violate the sovereign space again. That's some power right there. Just look at the TAZ and the power they control through Baffin, even if they rarely restrict access.
But as Jinx said, factions are more about RP enjoyment than power. Faction systems are a chance to add something permanent and potentially awesome (as the really well-made faction systems tend to be) to Discovery.
If someone's really a 'lolwutter', then they can be sanctioned for ooRP behavior, ooRP is system chat, etc. If you can't come up with the evidence for a sanction, then he's not a lolwutter.
![[Image: Ani-sig.gif]](http://i352.photobucket.com/albums/r330/SilentAssassin82/Ani-sig.gif)
![[Image: sig-9566.jpg]](http://www.clintonio.com/sig-9566.jpg)
![[Image: Aai7V.png]](http://i.imgur.com/Aai7V.png)
![[Image: just_a_signature_by_sjrarj-d63yjsx.png]](https://img00.deviantart.net/ca73/i/2013/123/e/a/just_a_signature_by_sjrarj-d63yjsx.png)
