How to make official factions better?

[casero]

Well, even when I'd looooooove to get more power on my overpowered Chujo, and even when some of these ideas are great, the first post made by Cannon is losing its purpose a bit.

Before anointing the official factions with these -cool- things (like the Leader ID, the /lockdown (for leaders only), the discount in some items due to the ID), remember, what made you join your faction? Something has changed?

There are people who likes to be independents, and that's not going to change just for adding cool stuff to the O.factions. And people joining the factions to get the cool stuff, is what we want? For example, restrict the capital ships to official factions, sure a lot of people will try to join it, then they will be official, then they get their cap, then they screw it like if they were lolwut indies (not take me wrong, there are awesome indies, but the point to restrict it is to avoid caplolwuts right?). Some factions are easier to climb on the ranks than others, some factions allow their lower rank bigger ships than other.

Example, in the [LN], to get a gunboat you have to be Lieutenant Commander, that's the 5th rank, that means that you have to work to get it, just a Siege cruiser is the 6th rank. So, if you want a capital ship you have to work a lot of time to get it, and a lot of people don't want to do it, so, they quit or they never join in the first place. Alright, one lolwut less, but, the whole point isn't to get more people in the faction?

To get more people in the faction you don't need to offer them a wonder world, nor tons of special things, because if they join wanting just those things, they are not joining to the faction, but they are joining to the power.

What's my point?
Remember what made you to join a faction, if it was one person, a friend, if it was their actions in game, if it was the faction status, the recruitment office. And emule that.
Also, be the best person you can be. Some factions have a hard RP (pirates, terrorist, privateers, KNF (?):P) but remember that a simple PM with // in the begining could make you a new friend or save a bad moment to someone.

But even then, a lot of people don't want to join, just because they need more freedom in their characters.
Tito Vendetta (corsair) will never join an official faction (even when he was invited) just because I need him to be free.
Like me, there is a lot of people.

I belive that we need to get to a compromise between O. Factions and indies, the factions must respect the indies as equals, and the indies must respect the factions as the people who leads the NPC faction, and their general relations. One thing shouldn't step over the other.





Note: Please give the O. Factions those shinny new things:Pbut remember if they get those new things, it doesn't mean that official factions will be better, nicer or that they will change because of it. It's not about the size, but how you do use it.

Note 2: You can ruin someone's day in a capship or a bomber, as above, it's not about the size.

[Barrier]

I've got some ideas of my own. I'll just toss them out.

- The faction leader chooses which capital ships to restrict to the faction's members, indies would have to submit a SRP

- Being a part of an official faction grants you the locations of Jump Holes, Bases, etc.

- Official Faction members get a salary, the amount agreed upon by the faction leader (Not sure if Flhook can do this)

Okay, here's the big one:

- When entering an official faction, you are granted a particular amount of credits to do with as you please. You are not allowed to transfer money to your faction character from your indy trader/miner. In order to be able to buy more expensive ships, you would either have to wait upon your salary, create a trading ship for the same faction, or submit a request to your leader. Faction leaders would then have to arrange something with the admins about the credits.

[barrenwzste]

Indies unbalance the game.

1: They have far less checks and balances placed upon them. They can, and do, run around in places thier faction tags shouldn't be, fly ships and equipment thier factions shouldn't, and role play however the whim takes them. I've seen Rhineland Gunboats in the heart of Liberty, Liberty Cruisers enforcing laws they made up themselves, and Corsairs Landing on Lawful bases. I'm not saying factions don't have these problems, but thier regulation keeps it to a minimum. People in factions do not want to lose rank or standing, and the threat of such helps moderate thier actions. The only moderation placed on indies is that which they place themselves and the few basic server rules.

2: Independants retard the role playing growth and evolution of the game. It is called ROLE playing for a reason. You pick a role you like, and play it. There is enough of a variety that everybody can find something they like. When indies take and say they are something, but then toss aside all the parts of the role they don't like, they aren't playing the role. In most cases, they are sacrificing role playing to achieve something in game mechanics. Take the rogues for example. I have seen all kinds of indie rogues, and I'm betting it's because they don't want to start out with the wimpy bloodhound type ships the faction requires. Well, it requires it because it's part of the Rogue role. By bypassing or discarding it you are playing outside the role, or playing ooc.

3: The current system rewards independents by allowing them to obtain equipment and to engage in behavior that players in the factions cannot. This is very definately not right, as it is the factions that drive the role play within the community that is Freelancer. Shouldn't the players who keep the community going by playing thier roles be the ones rewarded? What would happen if all the lawfuls in Liberty suddenly left the factions and subjected us to thier different and dissimilar views of Lawful Justice? Think about it, you aren't a police officer just because you buy a gun and a uniform. You have to go through the training, prove you are both physically and mentally fit for the role, and then gain the respect of your superiors and peers.

4: By limiting and/or negating the indipendant players abillity to achieve certain things, you encourage them to join whichever faction suits them best. Some will rebel, no doubt, and play only mediocre examples of thier factions. Those are still better than the chaos create by playing roles at odds to the ones they declare. And for those who refuse to play by the faction rules, well, they can still be a force within the game. Just because they can't get the best ships doesn't mean they can't have fun. A bomber is still a powerful ship, and a train still carries a lot of cargo. They can still have fun, pirate, make millions, they just have a lessened impact on the rest of us who will follow the rules and guidelines.

---

"Two things I know; Gravity sucks and Ion Storms blow. And that proves the universe is trying to kill us all" - Barren Waste, Captain of the Wasteland Wanderer

An approximation of my reaction when I see my next victim...er, these forums.

[ryoken]

Summary:
What are factions good for?
What are their purposes, their duties?
Derived from this, which rights do they need to attend their duties?
What additional benefits or disadvantes are needed to balance their duties with their rights?

Forget equipment, credits, ships, commodities and IDs.

This i like. Give the faction's access to special gear,on a as needed basis. Not for whenever they want it.

I also think if Faction's get bonuses, they should also get some negative's.
For example... You are a Hacker? you go no where there is not a Hacker NPC.
You are a Outcast? you go no where there is no Outcast NPC's
You are a Zoner? you go no where there is no Zoner NPC's
And so on....... And when i say no where, i mean no traveling through space without your kind,no chasing into space with out your kind,and no Pirating in space without your kind.

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[Evan_]

(..) role-players find role-playing to be it's own reward (...)

That partial sentence is so close to my hearth that I wanted to cut it out of its original sarcastic context and clean the dust from it. Have you ever thought about how being in an offical fraction affects your roleplaying possibilities? My humble opinion is that's a great deal to not be alone, and not becuse you can pirate in packs. Why? Because there are experienced players there, who are monitoring the events in Sirius probably for years. And their knowledge is what a rookie realy needs out there.

If you play a tabletop rpg and unsure of something - you ask the storyteller. But Sirius is so vast. And if you ask the wrong people you'll be misinformed. But how would you know who to ask here? I'd think someone who's been here long enough and having enough time to maintain a long-lasted fraction is your best bet.

Example. Do you know why corsairs and outcasts hates each other? Yeah, so do I. But I guess if we'd go to ask their offical fraction leaders about it we'd be ashamed how many details we didn't knew about. Of course I can make my own theory about that and roleplay acordingly. But when I (my char of course) says something as a member of an offical fraction, I feel myself backed up by players more competent than myself. Even if they never did anything for it other than not telling me that 'you are doing it wrong'.

I imagine some only need to be in a situation like this to feel 'lorded'. Call me cynic but no special gadget would overcome the feelings of those peolpe. It needs a realization. Others might be able to accept any restrictions just to be supervised.

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[Thurgret]

You are aware that characters in factions are generally more strictly restricted - even with regard to ZoI - than any indie is already, right?

[ryoken]

Indies unbalance the game.

1: They have far less checks and balances placed upon them. They can, and do, run around in places thier faction tags shouldn't be, fly ships and equipment thier factions shouldn't, and role play however the whim takes them. I've seen Rhineland Gunboats in the heart of Liberty, Liberty Cruisers enforcing laws they made up themselves, and Corsairs Landing on Lawful bases. I'm not saying factions don't have these problems, but thier regulation keeps it to a minimum. People in factions do not want to lose rank or standing, and the threat of such helps moderate thier actions. The only moderation placed on indies is that which they place themselves and the few basic server rules.

2: Independants retard the role playing growth and evolution of the game. It is called ROLE playing for a reason. You pick a role you like, and play it. There is enough of a variety that everybody can find something they like. When indies take and say they are something, but then toss aside all the parts of the role they don't like, they aren't playing the role. In most cases, they are sacrificing role playing to achieve something in game mechanics. Take the rogues for example. I have seen all kinds of indie rogues, and I'm betting it's because they don't want to start out with the wimpy bloodhound type ships the faction requires. Well, it requires it because it's part of the Rogue role. By bypassing or discarding it you are playing outside the role, or playing ooc.

3: The current system rewards independents by allowing them to obtain equipment and to engage in behavior that players in the factions cannot. This is very definately not right, as it is the factions that drive the role play within the community that is Freelancer. Shouldn't the players who keep the community going by playing thier roles be the ones rewarded? What would happen if all the lawfuls in Liberty suddenly left the factions and subjected us to thier different and dissimilar views of Lawful Justice? Think about it, you aren't a police officer just because you buy a gun and a uniform. You have to go through the training, prove you are both physically and mentally fit for the role, and then gain the respect of your superiors and peers.

4: By limiting and/or negating the indipendant players abillity to achieve certain things, you encourage them to join whichever faction suits them best. Some will rebel, no doubt, and play only mediocre examples of thier factions. Those are still better than the chaos create by playing roles at odds to the ones they declare. And for those who refuse to play by the faction rules, well, they can still be a force within the game. Just because they can't get the best ships doesn't mean they can't have fun. A bomber is still a powerful ship, and a train still carries a lot of cargo. They can still have fun, pirate, make millions, they just have a lessened impact on the rest of us who will follow the rules and guidelines.

Bang's head........

Why not just call this freelancer "factions" then mate. As you truly only care for them.

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[ryoken]

You are aware that characters in factions are generally more strictly restricted - even with regard to ZoI - than any indie is already, right?

Work's both way's. Even an indie Corsair should not be in say liberty. But yet i still see it. Hmmm... is this what factions call "restricted"?

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[lousal]

Indies unbalance the game.
1: They have far less checks [...] rest of us who will follow the rules and guidelines.

Exactly my thoughts.

[barrenwzste]

Work's both way's. Even an indie Corsair should not be in say liberty. But yet i still see it. Hmmm... is this what factions call "restricted"?

- Ryoken

You realize this strengthens my stand, not yours, right? Factions don't have control over where indies go and what indies do. If you are seeing indie pilots doing things against thier id/faction then you are helping to prove my point.

Ok, in Freelancer, factions = communities/societies. Being a freelancer doesn't mean you aren't a part of any communities and societies, it means you work for yourself, your profits are your own. You still have to obey the dictates of the societies you are in. If you are a freelance journalist in america you don't get to own slaves and smoke in the non-smoking section just because you don't work for a large company. Yet, this is what the indies are arguing for in this thread. They want the abillity to be called Corsairs, without following the dictates of the Corsair society. But if you don't follow the dictates of a society, you cease to be a member of that society. You will either be kicked out or imprisoned. Since the heads of factions can't do anything more than put contracts out on indies that are misbehaving and ignoring the role, they get away with it. I'm saying lets put limitations on thier abillities to do so. That isn't unfair, everybody else in the game has abide by the limitations, work within the system, why shouldn't they have to?

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"Two things I know; Gravity sucks and Ion Storms blow. And that proves the universe is trying to kill us all" - Barren Waste, Captain of the Wasteland Wanderer

An approximation of my reaction when I see my next victim...er, these forums.