On the topic of cheaters, they will always be around, they always have been around. Maybe they are more prevalent now than before (don't know personally), but that shouldn't grind development to a halt. They'll do the same stuff in .87 that they are doing in .86, so you'll be no worse off than before if it is released.
However, in this particular case, releasing right now might not be the best idea. There are a lot of changes that were made that should not have been (guard system merges with other guard systems and normal systems together, and the moving of normal systems in such a way that breaks their lore. And the changes to Gallia's interconnectivity being made into an even bigger mess than before), and it's my personal opinion (as a former dev) that those system changes should be rolled back to their original state, minus whatever changes were made for storyline reasons, before releasing it, otherwise it'd be an even bigger problem that would be even more difficult to correct later on (as they will inevitably need).
But the above should be done as quickly as possible and then the mod released, otherwise you risk the entire mod, and community, dissolving due to the lack of updates. Updates also need to happen in smaller, more timely, increments (which many many many devs have repeatedly called for over the years), rather than trying to make huge, grand releases after large periods of static.
The main problem with the dev team is how rest of the community like to sit on their high horses and lecture about how they can do this and that within a week and get a new version ready within a couple of months, but never actually stepping up to do anything, or coming up with a random excuse to get out of doing anything actually useful when they're offered a chance to help. .
That would be the same typical response other dev members have given over the course of the years; and has never had any merit.
Many, many members of the community have stepped up and helped out only to be drove away by other devs, left after the lack of anything getting done, or jump ship because of the attitude your displaying. (Not saying DPC has nothing to do with adding to the delay for 4.87)
The reason for the long delays is because of the disorganization within the dev team and an insistence on releasing 'grand' updates instead of smaller, quicker, more adaptive updates.
Also doesn't help that a large number of veteran devs jumped ship and are playing other games and chatter about Star Citizen.
(09-08-2013, 09:06 AM)aerelm Wrote: The main problem with the dev team is how rest of the community like to sit on their high horses and lecture about how they can do this and that within a week and get a new version ready within a couple of months, but never actually stepping up to do anything, or coming up with a random excuse to get out of doing anything actually useful when they're offered a chance to help. All the talk about "step aside so we take over and show you how it's properly done" is also the typical ego-centered internet behavior where people who can't actually do a thing just want the position and the attention of being the "lead dev" and can't bear the shame of being "a nobody who actually gets stuff done".
The current dev team is far from perfect and far from active, no argue with that, but with the whole community simply sitting, watching and whining about how "they" can do it better while actually not doing a thing... My question is - Why are you even surprised? Complaining for the sake of complaining topped off by their egos pretty much results in threads like this popping up every now and again, and even when offered a chance to contribute something to the community as a whole, same people who post in these sorts of threads simply chicken out by saying random crap like "things will go nowhere with the current people in charge" or "there's no way I'll join a team with person X and Y in it", and naturally nothing will get done long as you're putting your personal importance and egoboost above the actual progress of the mod.
(09-08-2013, 11:39 PM)Daedric Wrote: That would be the same typical response other dev members have given over the course of the years; and has never had any merit.
Many, many members of the community have stepped up and helped out only to be drove away by other devs, left after the lack of anything getting done, or jump ship because of the attitude your displaying. (Not saying DPC has nothing to do with adding to the delay for 4.87)
The reason for the long delays is because of the disorganization within the dev team and an insistence on releasing 'grand' updates instead of smaller, quicker, more adaptive updates.
Also doesn't help that a large number of veteran devs jumped ship and are playing other games and chatter about Star Citizen.
In response; allow me to quote a similar conversation from a similar thread:
(08-13-2013, 07:15 PM)Hone Wrote:
(08-13-2013, 02:29 PM)Echo 7-7 Wrote: Funny... this was basically implemented in the Infocarding department. Guess what happened? Most of the community volunteers flaked out and produced next to nothing.
Well I was one of those volunteers. When I first joined, we had a clear task to do, but after we'd done that, we were not given another clear task for months, just talk about dev concepts the non devs didnt understand and "yes we'll really have to give them something to do" of course people lost motivation. When I was finally given something to do, writing the infocard and rumours for a base, I completed it to above minimum specification, and then heard nothing for months again, at which point the chat was suddenly moved without me.
So I dont think you should really be blaming us.
Also Id like to say I appreciate our Dev team giving up its time to work on our mod.
(08-14-2013, 03:30 AM)Echo 7-7 Wrote:
Hone Wrote:So I dont think you should really be blaming us.
I didn't mean to blame you, exactly, as the fault is partially a managerial one; I simply provided an example of a proposed idea that didn't exactly backfire, but neither did it work exactly how we would have liked.\
As for RTW:
(09-08-2013, 04:28 PM)Bootsiuv Wrote:
(09-07-2013, 09:50 AM)Hone Wrote: Yeah I recently started a Carthaginian campaign. Just took my army through the Alps, and am currently in Cisalpine Gaul attacking Rome from the North, while I launch seaborn raids to sack cities in the south.
Dude I hope your not playing Vanilla. Download Europa Barbarorum if you haven't done so already. I'll just say your welcome now.
(09-08-2013, 04:39 PM)Govedo13 Wrote: The coolest Rome mod is Roma Surrectum II: http://www.moddb.com/mods/roma-surrectum-ii
It is even better then the console preped shiet called Rome II.
I saw both those mods when I was browsing the rome forums a year or so back, but neither really appealed to me, I ended up just making my own mod, trying for a more realistic damage mod effect (cos the fights are just pathetic when the guys stab at each other every 5 seconds or so really slowly and dont kill each other) using Hadrian and Caligula mod tools, as well as Ini. Editing.
I then played the Viking mod for Barbarian invasion, and the Bernard Cornwell Uthred mod for THAT mod!
However I only recently, re-installed and am so now basically playing vanilla, except for a quick ini mod I made to nerf level 2 and 3 siege towers.
-Cos come on, free ballista and super armour for no more build point cost? It means the guy who built the large or epic stone wall has a DISADVANTAGE!
I fixed your spacing because it was horrendous. Seriously, do you have a cat on your return key or something? As for the content, I'll leave that to the mods to decide. -Champ
User was banned for: Griefing others
Time left: (Permanent)
It aims for historical accuracy above all else. I always thought the immersion was far greater than any other mod when you were dealing with historical figures who were actually controlling an empire at the time.
EB implemented a lot of neat additional features, such as victories, various empire infrastructure (like creating puppet regimes instead of just having another full fledged province), and other stuffz.
The main problem with the dev team is how rest of the community like to sit on their high horses and lecture about how they can do this and that within a week and get a new version ready within a couple of months, but never actually stepping up to do anything, or coming up with a random excuse to get out of doing anything actually useful when they're offered a chance to help. .
That would be the same typical response other dev members have given over the course of the years; and has never had any merit.
Many, many members of the community have stepped up and helped out only to be drove away by other devs, left after the lack of anything getting done, or jump ship because of the attitude your displaying. (Not saying DPC has nothing to do with adding to the delay for 4.87)
The reason for the long delays is because of the disorganization within the dev team and an insistence on releasing 'grand' updates instead of smaller, quicker, more adaptive updates.
Also doesn't help that a large number of veteran devs jumped ship and are playing other games and chatter about Star Citizen.
I think being the longest-running dev member (I was the 3rd member to join the dev team, after Angel) gives me the legitimacy to say that the above post is highly accurate.
I only mention this because it seems a common retort to say that only the devs really know how the dev team works.. Well I believe I have more experience than anyone else and saw the team from its inception through to its gradual decline a year ago.
I am only commenting on this topic (while I hover on the other thread about the storyline before I go away again), because I have been pretty frustrated by the unfair criticism of people giving very legitimate and accurate feedback on this topic, under the premise of "you don't know how it is." So, as one who does, and who no longer has skin in the game, I think I can be considered fairly objective about the situation.
The two largest reasons for new and veteran devs leaving the team were both mentioned in Daedric's post. Other devs, and the lack of progress. The dev team was very vile amongst its own members. People had a lot of biases, and those biases were, frankly, left free to do as they please, to the detriment of others trying to contribute. This created an atmosphere of distrust and dislike between the devs, who needed to work together. This, combined with the lack of progress, was a major problem. The cherry on top, at least in the last year I was here (starting 2 years ago), was in the leadership also being dismissive, sometimes insultingly so, to many member's proposals, especially those of new members. I don't know if it was driven by a belief that they "just knew better" than the new guys, or if it was a sort of territorial thing, but it caused a lot of angst.
The process of releasing grand updates, as Daedric mentioned, is also one of the main reasons for community population decline between releases. Things get stagnant. The admin team has attempted to make up for that with large events, such as the Rheinland gold shortage (for any of you who remember it). That has helped, but it can't replace the benefits of smaller incremental updates, especially in the areas of lore and gameplay.
EDIT: I would like to note that this is only my view of the dev team up until I left it. Many of the newer devs I have not had an experience of being a dev with, thus this does not reflect on them. However, it is accurate up to the summer of 2012.
EDIT2: Something I forgot to mention. When looking back at the old releases of Discovery, one notices that they were released in a much more rapid fashion. Every new release has taken more time than the last. Part of this is on each release having more content than before, which is itself a problem. Another reason is because of the decision making process used by the new team leadership. When Igiss led it, decisions were made by him promptly, and then work could begin. While this wasn't always a good thing, most of the time it was, and it led to much more activity amongst the devs and projects getting completed faster as people weren't sitting around wondering "if I start working on this project, will it get torpedo'd two months from now and make all my work worthless?"
This was an unfortunate reality among the team in its last few years. Even if you gained permission for a project or change, it was not guaranteed that permission was still going to be there by the time the project was actually submitted, or that the project would be included when the mod was finally released. No one wants to work on a project when they can't find out if it'll even be accepted or not. Projects that have prompt permission, and the dev's faith in that permission staying, have a better chance of success. When making a new system requires you to get permission from a storyline lead, a system lead, the commodity/trade team lead, and then finally the dev team lead.. The red tape isn't even worth it. A dev team isn't a bureaucracy, yet we've turned it into one. And the team leaders were not a group of people who delegated work either. They were primarily a "this is why you can't do that" person of the team. Many of the team leaders worked on their own projects, and only got involved when people came to them to ask permission to do a project. Only the infocard team worked as a proper team with delegation and cooperation.
Dude, you should totally join in the OC drama ingame and get a tridente named the Dabtastic.Tridab.
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PSA: If you have been having stutter/FPS lag on Disco where it does not run as smoothly as other games, please look at the fix here: https://discoverygc.com/forums/showthrea...pid2306502
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