Capships + Traders

[McNeo]

Do not that the Guard IDs say you MAY attack and demand from hostile traders.. However, it does NOT say you can do so in a capship. Guard IDs are also used for fighters/bombers/transports/GBs. So the ID does not contradict the rules at all. You may demand hostile traders drop cargo and turn back, but you may not do so with a cruiser or battleship.

I agree with Dab. I'm not sure if that's a bad thing.:unsure:

But in all seriousness, I know it's frustrating as a Corsair, seeing an Outcast in a Borderworlds Transport go past your Legate with a full load of Cardamine. It's equally frustrating in a Liberty Dreadnought sitting outside the Alaska gate in Zone 21 when you see a Corsair in a Pirate Train carrying a full load of artifacts.

However, I think the problem here isn't the rules that should be changed to allow you to shoot them when such things happen, as you would if it were reality. The problem here is, you love your dreadnought or cruiser too much. I mean, hey, I sometimes find that in my Kusari destroyer, Zoners or whatever taking things through the Taus into Bretonia. What can I do about it? Sod all.

The very clear message here is this:

"Don't like it? Jump in a gunboat or smaller ship."

It's a very simple solution that is being overcomplicated a lot by people wanting just that little bit extra. Remember, trading is hard enough as it is. It doesnt need to be made harder by huge capital vessels murdering the everliving crap out of trading ships before they can even thrust out of range.

[jimmy Patterson]

look at some of the traders a pirate transport with cap 8 has as much armor as a friggin LABC a gb wont do crap to it nor will a lone bomber and sadly i find myself alotta times in liberty alone in my LABC with smugglers about en mass(rhineland build ships and ided ships included) is it not my duty to protect liberty would say a US Navy destroyer let a cocaine speedboat by just becase he couldent engage it cause USCG is supose to? i think not

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[McNeo]

My cap VIII slave liner (which now is in the process of slowly being broken down into its base components) had 880k armour before the nerf. My friend, that is more than some battleships unchanged armour (but, what battleships go around without armour upgrades these days?). A lone bomber with an SN and a CD will take it down if it's flown properly. It'll take time, sure, but thats what Transport armour is there for; to give traders time to escape.

Simply put, the Slave Liner, one of the heaviest transports both offensively and defensively, does not have the offensive power of a cruiser. Yeah, sure, it's transport turrets arent so bad when you compare them to cruiser primaries, but what really sets them apart is cruiser heavy weapons.

In a kusari destroyer, you can halve a gunboat shield in a pass. Double inferno, double battlerazor, which is a universal loadout for killing everything except battleships.
Now tell me that is fair, against even the most heavily armoured badass trader.
This gets even worse when its a heavy cruiser/siege cruiser, and you add in a light mortar.
And worse when its a Battlecruiser or a Dreadnought.

Transports have the armour so they can get away from assailants. Thats the only reason they have this armour, so they can get to safety before they blow up. Gunboats and Bombers do have good chances to kill even the heaviest trader. Just, not before they dock on a base. Perhaps this is the problem?

[atlantis2112]

US Navy destroyer let a cocaine speedboat by just becase he couldent engage it cause USCG is supose to?

I agree with this.

[Primus Avatar]

i just don't get it.... why speculate?
The admins will come in sooner or later and resolve it once and for all anyway...

i mean... one side will surely be wrong about it....


I side with Agmen's opinion.

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wassup

[Bauer]

It's simple really.

IDs take precedence over the rules. The Guard IDs state you can destroy traders who belong to the house you are at war with (they need to have the correct ID I believe), who don't drop their cargo and leave, even if your in a battleship/cruiser.

The Outcast/Corsairs IDs state that you can destroy anything in Alpha/Gamma that isn't carrying a non-allied ID, even if your a BS/Cruiser and they're a transport.

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[10:10:28 AM] Josh (Dejavu): Bauer is legendary to the LPI, I joined because I wanted to be that epic.

[tansytansey]

look at some of the traders a pirate transport with cap 8 has as much armor as a friggin LABC a gb wont do crap to it nor will a lone bomber and sadly i find myself alotta times in liberty alone in my LABC with smugglers about en mass(rhineland build ships and ided ships included) is it not my duty to protect liberty would say a US Navy destroyer let a cocaine speedboat by just becase he couldent engage it cause USCG is supose to? i think not

Pirate Transport: 115000 armour
Liberty Assault Battlecruiser: 450000 armour.

Now tell me, how many LABCs do you see without at least 2.5x armour? 900000 armour is a lot more than 460000. You can't argue that an armoured ship has more armour than an unarmored ship.
Also the argument that no one would stand a chance is also irrelevant in a skill based game. Just because you can't do it yourself, doesn't mean it's impossible. Hell, I've killed cap 8 Adv. Trains in my Greyhound solo.

It's not the responsibility of warships to stop Embargo runners or smugglers or whatever. It's to fight wars against other capital class vessels. Hell, capital ships probably shouldn't even be wasting time scanning transports in the surrounding area. When you fly a capital ship you choose to discard the role of interdiction of smugglers in favour of the role of war.
By the logic in this thread I could roll up to a tradelane in a Spyglass and kill any Ageria or IND transport I came across.

The rule is simple. Do not attack transports with cruisers and up. Complicating things only leaves room for exploitable loop holes, so lets keep things simple, and then we'll have no problems. In future I'd suggest making your smaller ships (Gunboats, bombers, fighters) your primary ship instead of rolling around in your big armour all the time. That way you'll be able to catch smugglers.
In fact, it makes more sense in-RP to have capital vessels docked until they are needed. Imagine the resources an LABC uses up just sitting idle at the Alaska JG. Probably more resources than 5 Gunboats.

So here's my suggestion to all of you:
Fly your bomber/gunboat/whatever when you're just roaming around looking for smugglers and pirates and whatnot. Only bring out your Cruisers, Battlecruisers and whatever when the situation calls for it. Like, a Rhienland invasion or Outcast destroyers attacking New York again. Because it's just not necessary to have your massive capital ships flying all the time.

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[5:50:49 PM] JakeSG (William Darkmoor) says: I like you, Ashes. You're more cynical than God.

[jimmy Patterson]

tell that to the WW2 "comerce raider" light cruiser emden of the Krigsmarine and a cap 8 pirate trans has the same armor as a cap6 LABC besides i only runinto the lolwut powersmugglers anyway the others i see and let go as they actually rp like jamming sensors or holodecoys or something

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[tansytansey]

tell that to the WW2 "comerce raider" light cruiser emden of the Krigsmarine and a cap 8 pirate trans has the same armor as a cap6 LABC besides i only runinto the lolwut powersmugglers anyway the others i see and let go as they actually rp like jamming sensors or holodecoys or something

Freelancer =/= real life. Here on Discovery we have a thing called fairplay. And a cap 8 P transport on has 10000 more armour than an unarmoured LABC. Check your facts.

Pirate Transport

Designed by the Liberty Rogues, the Pirate Transport is one of the few transport-class vessels available for unlawful population of Sirius. This ship is too distincitive to be used for smuggling in areas heavily patrolled by police and military. However, the Transport is great choice for smugglers carrying goods from one pirate base to another using dangerous and lengthy routes. Heavy armor and advanced equipment come in handy if the ship is threatened by hostile pirates and bounty hunters alike.

Stats
Gun/Turret Mounts: 0/9
Armor: 115000
Cargo Space: 3400
Max Batteries/NanoBots: 450/450
Power Output: 70000
Max. Impulse Speed: 80
Equipment Mounts: CM, CD

Liberty Assault Battlecruiser
Liberty government was always aware that their most dangerous potential enemies are not pirates or smugglers, but other Houses. For the case of full-scale war between Houses, the Liberty Navy has a secret weapon that may unexpectedly turn the tide of any battle - a heavily armored and fast Assault Battlecruiser, capable of breaching enemy formations and quickly taking out key capital ships of the opposing side.

Stats
Gun/Turret Mounts: 0/12
Armor: 450000
Cargo Space: 1000
Max Batteries/NanoBots: 900/900
Power Output: 3600000
Max. Impulse Speed: 90
Equipment Mounts: CM, CD

115000 x4 (Cap 8) = 460000
450000 x1.1 (Armor I) = 495000

So even an LABC with the very most basic of fighter armour has more armour than a Cap 8 Pirate Transport.

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|Ashes and Draya's Epic Adventure|Ashes "Nighthawk" Yotaka|Nightfall|Eva Jones|
[5:50:49 PM] JakeSG (William Darkmoor) says: I like you, Ashes. You're more cynical than God.

[jimmy Patterson]

al lthis rule did " in effort of fairplay" is increse the l,olerfleets of powersmugglers(the ones who dont say ANYTHING but a curse when they die) and LOLERDESSIES/BC/Dreads/GB's yes it should be fair but smuggleing should not be as easy as tradeing
also whats this ive been told that even if atrader/smuggler engages a firendly pilot the cap cant come to asist

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