Thats a pretty nice post you wrote there Jinx.
But I still dont know what i should do if i encounter a Trader in Omicron Alpha. People use Alpha as shortcut. Yes, people do that. I have met a few people. Sometimes they are good and leave through the Tau Hole again. But others just ignore you. Its like: "He's in a Cruiser, he can't harm me. Just fly." I dont know what i should do in this happening.
Normally the trader would just be blown up. But the Rule is confusing me and others.
"Who is it doing this synthetic type of alpha beta psychedelic funkin'?"
' Wrote:Next time if you are caught breaking the embargo, would you wait for the capship owner to switch to a bomber or gunboat to treat you accordingly to a broken rule?
Speaking about fairplay. It sounds very fair to break the embargo in front of a destroyer/cruiser, which does operate at the frontline and metagaming by abusing a rule for your own benefit.
Its absolutely unfair to show a provoking behavior by breaking a blockade and then whine, whe you have to face the consequences of your provocation.
If i fly a trading vessel and do smuggle or break any embargos i do expect to get blown the hell out of me, if caught and not complying to orders. Indifferent what ship my opponent has and i never would report him, because he did right and because of fairness.
AoM
In the given situation, when the Destroyer had seen me the first time, and had switched to a bomber for when I came back, I would have roleplayed with him. Hell, I would have even roleplayed with his Destroyer if he had anything on his mind other than "drop the cargo or you die". I don't break embargoes and smuggle just to piss off capital ship owners, I do it for my own enjoyment. And no, it is not fun when a Cruiser starts shooting at you with very minimal roleplay. But thank you for the accusation.
Players are the ones who brought about this rule, they are the ones that asked for it. Now they are the ones complaining about it. All I can say is, you reap what you sow.
Not that I'm gonna go sanctioning cap ships left and right for shooting me (that was the only sanction I've ever submitted.. and only because of his blatant disregard to the rules) in fact I would be happy to roleplay with any capital ships that cross my path.
But then, there are just as many capital ships out there who will shoot a smuggler with minimal RP as there are Smugglers who will shield themselves behind the rules.
There is an alternative to interdicting Smugglers. Using a smaller ship. There is also an alternative to smuggling, and that's trading. I chose to accept the consequences of my Roleplay, which is being forced to drop cargo upon being caught by local law enforcement. If you fly a Cruiser or Battleship, you also accept the consequences of not being able to open fire on transports.
In this situation the Kusari Destroyer was attacking a Firefly transport in Leeds that was breaking the Embargo. If that's not evidence enough that Capital ships should not be attacking transports under any circumstances, then what is?
One last time, I'll even bold it for you to make it easier to read. If you want to stop smugglers, fly a god damn gunboat or bomber. End of Story.
Really... it's not that hard. You chose to fly a cruiser or battleship, you chose not to be able to interdict traders.
That example does not apply to the situation listed on Guard ID's. That was a Kusari cap killing a trader, had nothing to do with the trader being Bretonian.
I'll say again and this time I got confirmation for sure. The ID DOES overrule the server rule. If you are in a Kusari ID cap ship and a Bretonian BMM ID trader flies past, you are allowed to order him to drop his cargo and turn back. If he does not comply, you may kill him. The same goes for any house at war with another house. Rheinland cap, Liberty trader - Liberty cap, Rheinland trader - etc.
You will not get sanctioned for that, it is allowed.
When the ID doesn't permit, you may not shoot a trader in a cruiser or above. Ever. Period.
' Wrote:That example does not apply to the situation listed on Guard ID's. That was a Kusari cap killing a trader, had nothing to do with the trader being Bretonian.
I'll say again and this time I got confirmation for sure. The ID DOES overrule the server rule. If you are in a Kusari ID cap ship and a Bretonian BMM ID trader flies past, you are allowed to order him to drop his cargo and turn back. If he does not comply, you may kill him. The same goes for any house at war with another house. Rheinland cap, Liberty trader - Liberty cap, Rheinland trader - etc.
You will not get sanctioned for that, it is allowed.
When the ID doesn't permit, you may not shoot a trader in a cruiser or above. Ever. Period.
Any admins wish to voice an opinion on the matter? I'd really hate for us to have to just 'guess" as to what is right then get sanctioned because no clarification was given.
Iâll carry this flag
To the grave if I must
Because itâs flag that I love
And a flag that I trust
a BMM IDed and tagged trader ( preferably in a bretonian transport of shetland, percheron or shire type ) - flying into kusari controlled territory. - he is carrying material that can be used for bretonians war effords ( lets say - plutonium ) and is most certainly heading towards bretonia.
a destroyer is NOT activly intercepting that trader - but simply happens to meet him, cause he is doing border duties at some jumpgate.
so far - none of the ships made an attempt to really run into one another - so no one is to blame.
the trader is asked ( in RP, maybe even harshly - but that is to be expected ) to drop the cargo or turn into a living torch. ( due to the "we have little kiddies on the server" - the kusari captain will of course not swear and insult the bretonian - although.... i am sure he "should" do it )
the trader point blank refuses - but both sides are roleplaying the situation. - none of them goes "you know the rules, you must not touch me" or rubbish like that.
if the destroyer - after giving a lot more roleplay than a normal engagement would require, giving reason and making his intention more than clear - started to put some holes into the transport.
i would be very disappointed if he got sanctioned or even warned for that. - if that was the case - we should remove the "RP" tag from the server. ( seriously ) - but i do not think that such a perfectly RPed occasion would be sanctioned. - actually, i would not even expect the participants of such an incident to even THINK of reporting - but both parties to be fully satisfied with a small RP incident "well done".
this situation is still a delicate one. - both sides must know what they are about. - a bretonian caught in kusari space must know that he is in about as much danger as an outcast tagged and IDed adv. train approaching Crete.
sometimes a trader isn t aware of what he is doing - in that case, its important to explain the matter "in RP" - so players need to take their time. - sometimes the law enforcer isn t too patient - in which case the trader might make clear that *he is willing to RP it and not F1 or cruise away* - when both sides know that there is time and no need to "rush things" - both sides should be able to proceed to BOTH sides satisfaction.
a trader that is blown up by a lawful should always know "why" that happened. nothing is more frustrating than an impatient lawful ( somehow - an impatient pirate isn t as frustrating as an impatient police - don t ask me why... its just my opinion )
what such a situation cannot need is a lawful that wishes to see a blue message - and / or a trader that only wants to make money.... if possible without any interference. if one side shows a slight unwillingness to RP it out, the situation can quickly escalate and go terribly wrong.
I believe that ID should decide these situations. If Outcast tagged and IDed Train comes to Omega 41, Gamma or similar system he should be blown away no matter what ship engages him. If 3 Legats come to kill him then so be it, he is the enemy. Same goes for other war sides. You aren't killing a trader but an enemy. Of course since trader really can't defend himself you should try to solve problem by talking first. Roleplaying. Make him drop his cargo and destroy his shields then send him back home or something like that but if you ARE killed by a battleship don't whine about it. You are the enemy. If you don't like being killed in Kusari by Kusari Battleship while you fly BMM Train then don't go to Kusari? Independent Traders should have a bit more protection. They work for themselves so you must be careful but enemies are shoot on sight. What's the difference if they are comming in fighter, destroyer, battleship or a train?
' Wrote:I believe that ID should decide these situations. If Outcast tagged and IDed Train comes to Omega 41, Gamma or similar system he should be blown away no matter what ship engages him. If 3 Legats come to kill him then so be it, he is the enemy. Same goes for other war sides. You aren't killing a trader but an enemy. Of course since trader really can't defend himself you should try to solve problem by talking first. Roleplaying. Make him drop his cargo and destroy his shields then send him back home or something like that but if you ARE killed by a battleship don't whine about it. You are the enemy. If you don't like being killed in Kusari by Kusari Battleship while you fly BMM Train then don't go to Kusari? Independent Traders should have a bit more protection. They work for themselves so you must be careful but enemies are shoot on sight. What's the difference if they are comming in fighter, destroyer, battleship or a train?
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